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US Congress & The Legislative Branch Discuss Reid derides sanctuary cities bill as the 'Donald Trump Act' at the Political Forums; Originally Posted by GottaGo https://www.usimmigration.com/enforc...ate-level.html Understood. But states have done so because of the vacuum created by the " Lack ...

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Old 03-28-2017, 11:41 AM
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Default Re: Reid derides sanctuary cities bill as the 'Donald Trump Act'

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Originally Posted by GottaGo View Post
Understood. But states have done so because of the vacuum created by the "Lack Of Federal Action"

I was speaking of the constitutional authority, "As Enumerated," not what states and cities are doing in it's purposeful absence of enforcement.

States do in fact have some control of their borders but have no authority to deport foreign nationals. They must turn that duty over to the Feds.

And no where in the Constitution, or the legislation on the books, do they have the authority to refuse to do so. This legislation is not about forcing the states to perform immigration control. This is about cooperation between the States and the Feds, who are doing their constitutional duty.
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Old 03-28-2017, 01:45 PM
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Default Re: Reid derides sanctuary cities bill as the 'Donald Trump Act'

Listened to this debate between ACLU and ICE lawyers. I was trying to understand the ACLU position in regards to the Steinle murder and federal ICE detainers and what are the real reasons not to cooperate with ICE. Even though "Sanctuary City" isn't a legally defined term, it has a political definition. The ACLU guy pointed to the "Morales" case in which a person unfairly spent some extra time in jail due to an ICE snafu.





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Old 03-28-2017, 02:19 PM
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Default Re: Reid derides sanctuary cities bill as the 'Donald Trump Act'

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Originally Posted by ShivaTD View Post
Let's apply the "rule of law" to this.

The police stop a person for whatever reason. They run a criminal check on the person and no warrants appear. When local law enforcement is done the person is released because there are no outstanding warrant against the person.

The person then later commits a murder. WTF difference does it make if the person was an illegal alien or a natural born citizen?

The rule of law requires the government to secure an arrest warrant to authorize law enforcement to detain the person. Our immigration laws are federal laws and the federal government is responsible for the investigations of violations of federal law and to obtain the arrest warrant.

It is not the role or responsibility of local and state law enforcement agencies to perform federal law enforcement investigations. They're not even trained for this law enforcement activity. They're authorized state law enforcement agencies and the enforcement of state and local law is their role and responsibility. The only responsibility that local and state law enforcement has related to federal crimes is to detain a person if there's an outstanding federal warrant for their arrest.

That is the Rule of Law in the United States.

Note: Being in the United States without proper documentation is not a criminal offense under federal law. It's an administrative civil offense. Local law enforcement releasing a person that has not been charged with a criminal offense, and that local law enforcement has no reason to suspect the person of committing a criminal offense, is not grounds for the condemnation of local law enforcement's actions. Just because someone "hates Mexicans" it doesn't provide a legal foundation for condemnation of the actions of local law enforcements role and responsibility to enforce the criminal laws of the state and communities within the state.

All issues of enforcement of our immigration laws falls under federal jurisdiction and not state jurisdiction. If there are complaints then direct those complaints at the law enforcement agencies that have jurisdiction.

I have a complaint. ICE is spending it's resources arresting, processing, and deporting undocumented aliens that don't represent a threat to the public safety. This is tying up there personnel that should be focused on tracking down, arresting, and processing undocumented criminal aliens that do represent a threat to the public safety. Unable to be in two places at the same time it means that ICE is allowing threats to our public safety, it's allowing that violent criminal illegal alien, to continue to walk the streets of the United States and commit murder while it's wasting it's manpower and resources deporting the woman that used a SSN not belonging to her to get a job.

Immigration law enforcement needs to be focused on the threat to the public safety instead of it's current focus on those that don't represent a threat to our public safety. When that "murder" is committed by the illegal alien then President Trump is ultimately responsible because he's changed the role of ICE from it's focus on the threat to public safety to mass deportation that allows the threat to continue to walk the streets of America.
You're right. After all that crap you wrote, I think the United States should use Mexico as a role model for immigrants and trespassers.
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Old 03-28-2017, 03:32 PM
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Default Re: Reid derides sanctuary cities bill as the 'Donald Trump Act'

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Originally Posted by GottaGo View Post
While in certain aspects, it is a good thing that Federal Law Enforcement does not supersede Local or State, there IS however, immigration enforcement at State levels.

So yes, it DOES matter.


State and local do not have policing powers over over immigration, under the rules established in 1952 with the passage of the Immigration and Nationality Act (INA) and the Immigration Reform and Control Act (IRCA) of 1986.
If you want the state to enforce immigration law the tell you congressman to pass legislation, and tells your state government to order your police to work with ICE, otherwise this "Donald Trump Act" is nothing more than political theater for the sicko fans.
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Old 03-28-2017, 03:34 PM
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Default Re: Reid derides sanctuary cities bill as the 'Donald Trump Act'

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Originally Posted by ShivaTD View Post
This is just another publicity stunt by the Trump administration.
The OP is about Hairy Reid's stunt, not Donald Trump's attempt to validate who enters the nation.



Quote:
Originally Posted by ShivaTD
Immigration law enforcement needs to be focused on the threat to the public safety instead of it's current focus on those that don't represent a threat to our public safety. When that "murder" is committed by the illegal alien then President Trump is ultimately responsible because he's changed the role of ICE from it's focus on the threat to public safety to mass deportation that allows the threat to continue to walk the streets of America.

I believe you are conflated. If public safety is the issue, how do we keep the nation safe if the borders are so porous anyone can walk in? After all over 11,000 million have in the last 20 years and not only do we not know who they are, it seems the left is hell bent on preventing any action which might find out. Worse, how do we remove known threats if the sanctuary policies shield them from capture?
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Old 03-28-2017, 03:42 PM
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Default Re: Reid derides sanctuary cities bill as the 'Donald Trump Act'

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Originally Posted by Mellon_Collie View Post
State and local do not have policing powers over over immigration, under the rules established in 1952 with the passage of the Immigration and Nationality Act (INA) and the Immigration Reform and Control Act (IRCA) of 1986.
If you want the state to enforce immigration law the tell you congressman to pass legislation, and tells your state government to order your police to work with ICE, otherwise this "Donald Trump Act" is nothing more than political theater for the sicko fans.
States and cities are over reaching to claim sovereignty over immigration policy which is exactly NOT that. So telling the state legislatures is mute.

However, I believe we did tell out Congressmen exactly that. The OP legislation which the President has asked for is exactly that. Until the Congress makes it law his EO is exactly that. So are you suggesting you're in agreement with "that"?

Or do you support the illegal acts of states to oppose "that?"
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Old 03-29-2017, 08:56 AM
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Default Re: Reid derides sanctuary cities bill as the 'Donald Trump Act'

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Originally Posted by FrancSevin View Post
And, for the sake of argument, if we assume you are correct then most certainly we need a Federal law providing legal muscle to the simple request by the feds to hold a known felon until they can pick them up.
Local law enforcement will always hold a person if there's a federal warrant for their arrest. Local and state law enforcement agencies virtually always run a criminal check to verify whether a person has any outstanding arrest warrants. If they miss one it would be by accident and not by intent.

What they won't do is hold a person when the federal government doesn't have an arrest warrant to authorize the detention of the person nor will they attempt to investigate possible violations of federal law that are outside of their jurisdiction under state law and the state Constitution.
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Old 03-29-2017, 01:45 PM
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Default Re: Reid derides sanctuary cities bill as the 'Donald Trump Act'

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Originally Posted by ShivaTD View Post
Local law enforcement will always hold a person if there's a federal warrant for their arrest. Local and state law enforcement agencies virtually always run a criminal check to verify whether a person has any outstanding arrest warrants. If they miss one it would be by accident and not by intent.

What they won't do is hold a person when the federal government doesn't have an arrest warrant to authorize the detention of the person nor will they attempt to investigate possible violations of federal law that are outside of their jurisdiction under state law and the state Constitution.
Not true, local law enforcement routinely hold suspected illegal aliens to allow the INS to determine the person's immigration status. It is called immigration detainer. Many local law enforcement agencies can detain criminal suspects or persons of interest for a day or two without filing charges.

When politicians can order local police to ignore laws because they don't like them the law becomes a joke.
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