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Science, Technology & Health Discuss Grass Makes Better Ethanol than Corn at the General Discussion; Farmers in Nebraska and the Dakotas brought the U.S. closer to becoming a biofuel economy, planting huge tracts of land ...

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Old 01-09-2008, 06:30 AM
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Default Grass Makes Better Ethanol than Corn

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Farmers in Nebraska and the Dakotas brought the U.S. closer to becoming a biofuel economy, planting huge tracts of land for the first time with switchgrass—a native North American perennial grass (Panicum virgatum) that often grows on the borders of cropland naturally—and proving that it can deliver more than five times more energy than it takes to grow it.
Grass Makes Better Ethanol than Corn: Scientific American
Quote:
...yields from a grass that only needs to be planted once would deliver an average of 13.1 megajoules of energy as ethanol for every megajoule of petroleum consumed—in the form of nitrogen fertilizers or diesel for tractors—growing them. "It's a prediction because right now there are no biorefineries built that handle cellulosic material" like that which switchgrass provides, Vogel notes. "We're pretty confident the ethanol yield is pretty close." This means that switchgrass ethanol delivers 540 percent of the energy used to produce it, compared with just roughly 25 percent more energy returned by corn-based ethanol according to the most optimistic studies.
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The U.S. Department of Energy (DOE) is partially funding the construction of six such cellulosic biorefineries, estimated to cost a total of $1.2 billion. The first to be built will be the Range Fuels Biorefinery in Soperton, Ga., which will process wood waste from the timber industry into biofuels and chemicals. The DOE is providing an initial $50 million to start construction.
Grass Makes Better Ethanol than Corn: Scientific American

The words of Merle Haggard have come true-
"We'll all be drinkin' that free Bubble-Up, and Eatin' that Rainbow Stew"


Or to quote a drunk uncle of mine, "When Pigs Fly"
Well, they're flying!

Who'd a thunk it? Gasoline from prairie grass. Why, just yesterday,
little Laura Ingles was playing there..
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Old 01-09-2008, 01:12 PM
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Default Re: Grass Makes Better Ethanol than Corn

Sounds promising...

The two biggest obstacles...

1) Do we have space to create enough switchgrass fields to produce the required amount for sustination (and will some bad weather destroy the crop?)...

2) What needs to be done in order to get the final product to stations to pass along to the public...
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Old 01-09-2008, 06:11 PM
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Default Re: Grass Makes Better Ethanol than Corn

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Originally Posted by cnredd View Post
Sounds promising...

The two biggest obstacles...

1) Do we have space to create enough switchgrass fields to produce the required amount for sustination (and will some bad weather destroy the crop?)...

2) What needs to be done in order to get the final product to stations to pass along to the public...

Depending on the turnover of growing, ie; time between each planting and harvesting. Is it faster than the corn? weathering mother nature is a difficult situation, because your more southern areas tend to be to sandy and grass doesn't grow as well...
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Old 01-10-2008, 02:02 AM
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Default Re: Grass Makes Better Ethanol than Corn

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Originally Posted by Yagmi View Post
Depending on the turnover of growing, ie; time between each planting and harvesting. Is it faster than the corn? weathering mother nature is a difficult situation, because your more southern areas tend to be to sandy and grass doesn't grow as well...
If I understood the article correctly, you don't have to replant switch grass??
It's like a weed. Cut it and it grows better.
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Old 01-10-2008, 02:09 AM
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Default Re: Grass Makes Better Ethanol than Corn

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If I understood the article correctly, you don't have to replant switch grass??
It's like a weed. Cut it and it grows better.
Yes, but there's still a turnover rate...It's not like oil where if you run out you just dig for more...

WAITING for it to grow back cuts into the feasability...Unless we have enough space to "extract" the grass in a pattern where patches of the grass is grown at different levels...
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Old 01-10-2008, 02:14 AM
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Default Re: Grass Makes Better Ethanol than Corn

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Originally Posted by cnredd View Post
Yes, but there's still a turnover rate...It's not like oil where if you run out you just dig for more...

WAITING for it to grow back cuts into the feasability...Unless we have enough space to "extract" the grass in a pattern where patches of the grass is grown at different levels...
I'm going to go out on a limb here and say any place that can grow corn, barley, oats and the like, can grow grass.
Plus, I'll betcha-I'll betcha you don't have to fertilize it a helluva lot.
What I'm thinking is every time I see a place unattended after farming it usually goes back to some kind of grass anyway.
Look how many times you have to mow your lawn in a season. Corn is a one time cut. But grass? I think we have a winner here!
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Old 01-10-2008, 02:21 AM
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Default Re: Grass Makes Better Ethanol than Corn

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I'm going to go out on a limb here and say any place that can grow corn, barley, oats and the like, can grow grass.
Plus, I'll betcha-I'll betcha you don't have to fertilize it a helluva lot.
What I'm thinking is every time I see a place unattended after farming it usually goes back to some kind of grass anyway.
Look how many times you have to mow your lawn in a season. Corn is a one time cut. But grass? I think we have a winner here!
As I said, it sounds promising....

But there are still questions...

Special kind of switchgrass or wild switchgrass?...

How much to make a gallon of fuel?...

How much time and what equiment is needed to make the change from grass to fuel?...

Can it be used for heating or just travel?...

How long before Democrats cry about the switchback labor force and demands they get government healthcare?...

Will this make Hillary cry?...

How long before Jesse Jackson shakes down upper management?...

Will Doctor Phil be there to sooth employee depression over laid off oil workers?...
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Old 01-10-2008, 09:56 AM
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Default Re: Grass Makes Better Ethanol than Corn

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Originally Posted by cnredd View Post
As I said, it sounds promising....

But there are still questions...

Special kind of switchgrass or wild switchgrass?...

How much to make a gallon of fuel?...

How much time and what equiment is needed to make the change from grass to fuel?...

Can it be used for heating or just travel?...

How long before Democrats cry about the switchback labor force and demands they get government healthcare?...

Will this make Hillary cry?...

How long before Jesse Jackson shakes down upper management?...

Will Doctor Phil be there to sooth employee depression over laid off oil workers?...
You need some sleep
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Old 01-11-2008, 03:21 AM
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Default Re: Grass Makes Better Ethanol than Corn

I would be willing to bet that GW did his homework on "switch grass" before he mentioned it several years ago in a State of the Union Address and the media barely noticed like they usually do and did not at all get the main point of the speech about it. That it is probably the BEST of the choices for a bio fuel source. Just as their vision is not long enough for them to recognize the same thing about hydrogen.
Speaking of grass that lowly hemp seed and fiber has always been one of the ultimate sources also, and may I quote from the Bible about "seed bearing herbs" being on Earth for man's use.
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Old 01-11-2008, 03:28 AM
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Default Re: Grass Makes Better Ethanol than Corn

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Originally Posted by cnredd View Post
As I said, it sounds promising....

But there are still questions...

Special kind of switchgrass or wild switchgrass?...With modern genetics does it really seem like a problem?

How much to make a gallon of fuel?...Will they be able to grow it in that desert called the middle east?

How much time and what equiment is needed to make the change from grass to fuel?...It will harvest similarly to hay and process like alcohol.

Can it be used for heating or just travel?...Fuel is fuel.

How long before Democrats cry about the switchback labor force and demands they get government healthcare?...

Will this make Hillary cry?...

How long before Jesse Jackson shakes down upper management?...

Will Doctor Phil be there to sooth employee depression over laid off oil workers?...
You sure are feisty tonight but at least it was funny towards the end.
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