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Religion & Philosophy Discuss Why Did God Create Atheists? at the General Discussion; I found this amusing because some people fail abjectly in even the above attempted interpretation. Some blindly assume that atheists ...

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Old 01-19-2016, 10:48 AM
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Post Why Did God Create Atheists?


I found this amusing because some people fail abjectly in even the above attempted interpretation. Some blindly assume that atheists have no morality because they cannot comprehend how it can be so without God.


Which at the end of the day is simple foolishness.
The Old Testament explicitly states that God gave Adam and Even the knowledge of right and wrong. Any religious person who thinks God is required in order to have this knowledge or in order to want to adhere to good is akin to a child who needs a threat of Santa Clause denying presents if he is bad...
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Old 01-19-2016, 11:44 AM
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Default Re: Why Did God Create Atheists?

So people like you had someting to belive in.
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Old 01-19-2016, 11:58 AM
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Default Re: Why Did God Create Atheists?

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Originally Posted by FrancSevin View Post
So people like you had someting to belive in.
I am not an atheist, more along the lines of an agnostic with Pagan/Deist leanings.

Have you ever listened to what some people say about their belief in God, and suddenly think: Boy, that sounds like a cult.

Being at peace with whatever you believe in, or not believe in, is the key to spirituality, not what ever religion, or not, tells you, you should believe.
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Old 01-19-2016, 07:54 PM
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Post Re: Why Did God Create Atheists?

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Originally Posted by FrancSevin View Post
So people like you had someting to belive in.
I don't even know what you're trying to say with that.

But one thing I have never understood is why some people think it's better to believe in "something" when you have no real significant data to push it one way or the other.

For example...
Jack lives in a house. Perhaps it has an attic and it's painted a color.
Do we feel a need to "believe" that Jack's attic is most likely painted red?
Is it rational for "red attic" people to start wars with "blue attic" people over the question?
Is it rational for "red attic" people to denigrate people who just freely admit they don't know if Jack has any attic to begin with...
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Old 01-19-2016, 08:07 PM
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Default Re: Why Did God Create Atheists?

Quote:
Originally Posted by foundit66 View Post

I found this amusing because some people fail abjectly in even the above attempted interpretation. Some blindly assume that atheists have no morality because they cannot comprehend how it can be so without God.


Which at the end of the day is simple foolishness.
The Old Testament explicitly states that God gave Adam and Even the knowledge of right and wrong. Any religious person who thinks God is required in order to have this knowledge or in order to want to adhere to good is akin to a child who needs a threat of Santa Clause denying presents if he is bad...
yeah free will and all that...
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Old 01-19-2016, 08:39 PM
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Default Re: Why Did God Create Atheists?

God didn't create Atheists, they've come to their own conclusions.
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Old 01-19-2016, 10:04 PM
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Default Re: Why Did God Create Atheists?

Quote:
Originally Posted by foundit66 View Post

I found this amusing because some people fail abjectly in even the above attempted interpretation. Some blindly assume that atheists have no morality because they cannot comprehend how it can be so without God.


Which at the end of the day is simple foolishness.
The Old Testament explicitly states that God gave Adam and Even the knowledge of right and wrong. Any religious person who thinks God is required in order to have this knowledge or in order to want to adhere to good is akin to a child who needs a threat of Santa Clause denying presents if he is bad...
Well the thing that's frustrating here is that no matter how many times an honest reply is given here it's always RE-FRAMED into ....

"Some blindly assume that atheists have no morality because they cannot comprehend how it can be so without God."
with the a spoken or unspoken
""

Look, the problem isn't that "atheist HAVE no morality", or CAN'T BE good without believing in God.
it's that they have NO REASON. No rational foundation for choosing good over evil.

in the story itself it mentions that the atheist HAS some internal moral compass. It compels them to do good and gives an UNREASONED , foundationLESS personal GUT feeling and motive to do right.
So OK, where did that come from?

Morals, right and wrong and kindness aren't even attempted to be formulated on scientific grounds. But people rarely say that morals aren't REAL.
And right here you are complaining that others falsely accuse you having none.

But what are morals exactly where did they come from?
Yes you and most atheist have them and use them.
The question Christians ask you to explain ..without God... is what are morals and WHY are morals.
And What reasons should compel anyone act morally?

All that comes back often is hand waving and then later it's back to pretending that Christians "say" you have no morals.


No, we all HAVE morals.
the Christian and most theist can say our morals are grounded in God who created us with them therefore those feeling are valid. AND he's had many morals codified and written for us for clarity. AND there are consequences on earth and after death eternal consequences for playing loose with morals. Morals are VITALLY important.

While the theist simply ask the atheist WHY do you think morals are important and where they came from. And if they are just HAPPY ACCIDENTS of a godless material world like the rest of the universe then might those moral feelings be mistaken? Do you really HAVE to take them so seriously? Sure you can and many do BUT, is there much consequence other than guilt feelings and some temporary pain to others?


I hope that helps clear up what the question should be about.
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Old 01-19-2016, 10:11 PM
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Default Re: Why Did God Create Atheists?

Quote:
Originally Posted by foundit66 View Post
I don't even know what you're trying to say with that.

But one thing I have never understood is why some people think it's better to believe in "something" when you have no real significant data to push it one way or the other.

For example...
Jack lives in a house. Perhaps it has an attic and it's painted a color.
Do we feel a need to "believe" that Jack's attic is most likely painted red?
Is it rational for "red attic" people to start wars with "blue attic" people over the question?
Is it rational for "red attic" people to denigrate people who just freely admit they don't know if Jack has any attic to begin with...
I guess the question is, is there any evidence that can push it one way or the other?
Few people take the time to seriously consider.
And no one considers the question objectively.

But you make the analogy about a house and debates over the attic color.
OK I'd just point out that Jack and all people find themselves in the house. But some people are tying to say the house came out of nowhere. That no one made the house in the 1st place. So why do we feel the need to deny the very existence of the materials and the evident high complexity and intelligent workmanship?

And sure there may be debates over the color of the attic that stupidly became wars. but if we have written records of eyewitness accounts of a few folks that have made it into the attic and back. It seems whichever side has to the most credible record is likely correct despite whatever other faults, horrible misdeeds and wars they've engaged in.
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Old 01-19-2016, 11:25 PM
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Default Re: Why Did God Create Atheists?

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Originally Posted by mr. wonder View Post
I guess the question is, is there any evidence that can push it one way or the other?
Few people take the time to seriously consider.
And no one considers the question objectively.

But you make the analogy about a house and debates over the attic color.
OK I'd just point out that Jack and all people find themselves in the house. But some people are tying to say the house came out of nowhere. That no one made the house in the 1st place.
Ya say that, but answer me this.
Where did your God come from?
Did somebody make him in the first place?


You don't even bother to question that, but the idea of the matter and energy of the universe always being here just seems like an alien and untenable idea to you, doesn't it...




And that's not even touching the fact that some people's explanation of Jack's house has been proven false by science.
Like the bible having a time-frame on the scale of a few thousand years ...
... until Christians have to revise their interpretation due to the earth and the universe being a LOT older than that...


The reality is that SCIENCE is the thing that sways the understanding this way or that.
The bible has no reliable source of factual information. It's called "belief" for a reason...


Quote:
Originally Posted by mr. wonder View Post
And sure there may be debates over the color of the attic that stupidly became wars. but if we have written records of eyewitness accounts of a few folks that have made it into the attic and back. It seems whichever side has to the most credible record is likely correct despite whatever other faults, horrible misdeeds and wars they've engaged in.
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Old 01-19-2016, 11:30 PM
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Default Re: Why Did God Create Atheists?

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Originally Posted by Lollie View Post
God didn't create Atheists, they've come to their own conclusions.
Good call, Lollie. I formed my own opinions when I was 12. I don't believe God had much to do with it.
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