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Religion & Philosophy Discuss Air Force caves to atheists at the General Discussion; Originally Posted by Joe Shoe Poor thing. Actually having to live in a pluralistic society and in the marketplace of ...

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Old 05-13-2012, 11:07 PM
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Post Re: Air Force caves to atheists

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Originally Posted by Joe Shoe View Post
Poor thing. Actually having to live in a pluralistic society and in the marketplace of public discourse is.. a ... bitch, isn't it?
It's not like religion isn't always under attack by anti-theists as well. But pretending anti-thiesm is all about defensive measure rather than the bigotry it is, probably makes you feel better, no doubt.
It's funny how the blue section is better suited as a response to your own comments.
Maybe you should take a dose of your own advice.
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Old 05-14-2012, 12:15 AM
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Default Re: Air Force caves to atheists

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Originally Posted by MrLiberty View Post
I have several friends who are atheists, and we talk about this crap all the time. They say if these people are truly atheists it wouldn't bother them that a book is in the room, or a cross is some where that they go. They tell me if you want to worship a book or a couple of sticks put together go ahead you're just wasting your time. Those so called atheists who wish to push religion into a closet are usually people who have doubts about what they believe and don't want to be reminded of their doubts.
I don't see the problem. Nobody took their right to have a bible. The air force is just not making sure one is in the room. So what? It is not the militaries business to make sure bibles are in a room. What if I like TV guide or Playboy. Should the air force be required to have them in a room also? The stuff folks get worked up about
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Old 05-14-2012, 12:31 AM
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Default Re: Air Force caves to atheists

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Originally Posted by MrWrite View Post
"Atheism" is a religion like "not collecting stamps" is a hobby.
Not true! This might well be true for Agnosticism , but Atheism is a faith-based belief system about the ultimate nature of existence. It's faith-based, because logic can't prove that something doesn't exist. Thus Atheism, especially in it's aggressive strains, is a religion.
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Old 05-14-2012, 08:42 AM
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Default Re: Air Force caves to atheists

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Originally Posted by Oftencold View Post
Not true! This might well be true for Agnosticism , but Atheism is a faith-based belief system about the ultimate nature of existence. It's faith-based, because logic can't prove that something doesn't exist. Thus Atheism, especially in it's aggressive strains, is a religion.
Atheists don't say that 'something' doesn't exist. There is nothing faith based about it in the slightest. Neither is it a belief system. Atheism is the LACK of a belief system.
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Old 05-14-2012, 09:33 AM
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Default Re: Air Force caves to atheists

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Originally Posted by rivrrat View Post
Atheists don't say that 'something' doesn't exist. There is nothing faith based about it in the slightest. Neither is it a belief system. Atheism is the LACK of a belief system.
That's why the term is inadequate to describe many of them, since so many go beyond just mere lack of belief, into OPPOSING belief. They're really often anti-theists.
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Old 05-14-2012, 10:12 AM
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Default Re: Air Force caves to atheists

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Originally Posted by Joe Shoe View Post
That's why the term is inadequate to describe many of them, since so many go beyond just mere lack of belief, into OPPOSING belief. They're really often anti-theists.
I don't oppose belief. I just don't think the government has any business supporting one. It crosses a line into theocracy.
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Old 05-14-2012, 08:47 PM
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Default Re: Air Force caves to atheists

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Originally Posted by Oftencold View Post
Not true! This might well be true for Agnosticism , but Atheism is a faith-based belief system about the ultimate nature of existence. It's faith-based, because logic can't prove that something doesn't exist. Thus Atheism, especially in it's aggressive strains, is a religion.
Where does this "in its agressive strains" goalpost-moving come in? By your fiat?

Nobody has to give any credence for something for which there is no evidence. Not believing is not a "not-believing belief." Or do you not understand how logic and simple definitions work?

(Your definition of atheism, btw, is not supported by any non-religiously-based dictionary. Suck it up.)
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Old 05-14-2012, 09:50 PM
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Default Re: Air Force caves to atheists

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Originally Posted by Oftencold View Post
Not true! This might well be true for Agnosticism , but Atheism is a faith-based belief system about the ultimate nature of existence. It's faith-based, because logic can't prove that something doesn't exist. Thus Atheism, especially in it's aggressive strains, is a religion.
Atheism, in its PURE form, is indeed a 'lack-of' state. An absence of belief. But that is only in its pure form, if that's even truly possible. My experience is that these people often tend to fill that vacancy of a belief system with a form of prejudice toward the very thing they claim a lack of belief toward. They therefore cross that line between mere "lack of" to a distinct "anti" ideology. We see that all the time in these forums, BTW. And in doing so, they undercut atheism itself, ironically. Because a TRUE atheist would care less what people believe since there's nothing out there anyway. I've even heard a few HONEST and PURE atheists admit that religion can be a good thing because it provides a source of community and hope to bereaved people, for instance.
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Old 05-14-2012, 09:55 PM
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Default Re: Air Force caves to atheists

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Originally Posted by Joe Shoe View Post
That's why the term is inadequate to describe many of them, since so many go beyond just mere lack of belief, into OPPOSING belief. They're really often anti-theists.
Indeed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Shoe View Post
Atheism, in its PURE form, is indeed a 'lack-of' state. An absence of belief. But that is only in its pure form, if that's even truly possible. My experience is that these people often tend to fill that vacancy of a belief system with a form of prejudice toward the very thing they claim a lack of belief toward. They therefore cross that line between mere "lack of" to a distinct "anti" ideology. We see that all the time in these forums, BTW. And in doing so, they undercut atheism itself, ironically. Because a TRUE atheist would care less what people believe since there's nothing out there anyway. I've even heard some HONEST atheists admit that religion can be a good thing because it provides a source of community and hope to bereaved people, for instance.
While I agree there are certainly anti-theists out there, without a doubt, I fear you might be confusing two different things. Most atheists do indeed not give a **** what other people believe... UNTIL their beliefs begin to affect US by way of legislation or other intrusions into our personal freedoms and choices.
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Old 05-15-2012, 10:44 AM
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Post Re: Air Force caves to atheists

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Originally Posted by rivrrat View Post
While I agree there are certainly anti-theists out there, without a doubt, I fear you might be confusing two different things. Most atheists do indeed not give a **** what other people believe...
No, rivrrat, you obviously do not know what's going on.
For some Christian, they understand what most atheists think better than the atheists themselves.


On another level, IMO the discussion trying to paint a significant number of atheists as being horribly oppressive is b.s.
I can quote example after example showing how Christians discriminating against atheists occurs publicly and with major support.
There was a poll not long ago about people rejecting an atheist presidential candidate.
"If your party nominated a generally well-qualified person for president who happened to be …, would you vote for that person?"
When ... was replaced with "atheist", the results were:
45% Yes
53% No

So over half of this nation (comprised primarily by Christians) would reject an atheist who who actually received the party nomination and who was "generally well-qualified"...
The implications of this being that the person involved would either vote for the OPPOSING party, or simply not vote at all. Just cause the candidate is atheist...

Yet some Christians complain about how discriminatory and awful atheists are while ignoring their own side of the equation which is worse (IMO)...
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