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The President & the Executive Branch Discuss Obama: Trayvon Martin 'could have been me' at the Political Forums; Originally Posted by Surly Oh goodness, a third thread with an unaswered question. Instead of complaining why don't you answer ...

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  #211 (permalink)  
Old 08-06-2013, 09:57 AM
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Default Re: Obama: Trayvon Martin 'could have been me'

Quote:
Originally Posted by Surly View Post
Oh goodness, a third thread with an unaswered question.
Instead of complaining why don't you answer the question I posed returning the courtesy shown by answering your leading question about racial profiling? Allow me to refresh your memory should Zimmerman have allowed Martin to continue beating on him inflicting more serious injury or death to avoid "frustrating" the black community?
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  #212 (permalink)  
Old 08-06-2013, 10:03 AM
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Default Re: Obama: Trayvon Martin 'could have been me'

No. I am all for killing someone when it is self defense. I have said all along Z did not look to me like someone that was beaten to within fear of his life, I think a full grown adult in his late 20's early 30's could have defended himself better withuot killing someone. But since the other side of the story was dead, not guilty was the appropriate finding. I dont think politics should have effected the outcome of the trial. Why do you continue to pretend I do?
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Originally Posted by AZRWinger View Post
Instead of complaining why don't you answer the question I posed returning the courtesy shown by answering your leading question about racial profiling? Allow me to refresh your memory should Zimmerman have allowed Martin to continue beating on him inflicting more serious injury or death to avoid "frustrating" the black community?
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  #213 (permalink)  
Old 08-06-2013, 10:52 AM
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Default Re: Obama: Trayvon Martin 'could have been me'

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Originally Posted by Surly View Post
No. I am all for killing someone when it is self defense. I have said all along Z did not look to me like someone that was beaten to within fear of his life, I think a full grown adult in his late 20's early 30's could have defended himself better withuot killing someone. But since the other side of the story was dead, not guilty was the appropriate finding. I dont think politics should have effected the outcome of the trial. Why do you continue to pretend I do?

In Chicago 5 cops in riot gear were afraid for their lives when a 95 year old threatened them with a shoe horn, they shot him point blank with a bean bag round that killed him. But Zimmerman should have been OK with a guy on his chest raining down blows.
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  #214 (permalink)  
Old 08-06-2013, 10:53 AM
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Default Re: Obama: Trayvon Martin 'could have been me'

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Originally Posted by Surly View Post
No. I am all for killing someone when it is self defense. I have said all along Z did not look to me like someone that was beaten to within fear of his life, I think a full grown adult in his late 20's early 30's could have defended himself better withuot killing someone. But since the other side of the story was dead, not guilty was the appropriate finding. I dont think politics should have effected the outcome of the trial. Why do you continue to pretend I do?
If you think the verdict was appropriate, why do you defend Obama's race baiting remarks based on the verdict? It cannot be both ways, either the verdict was correct or the President spoke out against the injustice.
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  #215 (permalink)  
Old 08-06-2013, 11:20 AM
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Post Re: Obama: Trayvon Martin 'could have been me'

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Originally Posted by AZRWinger View Post
Conveniently ignored is that President Obama made no reference to the stop and frisk policy. It has no relevance to the application of the term in the Zimmerman case.
We're talking about racial profiling.
You were trying to weasel out of acknowledging it exists by insisting that he's using the wrong definition.
I used your definition to prove racial profiling exists

The president's point was that racial profiling exists.
He wasn't going to give an exhaustive list. It's not a fault of his point that he didn't give an exhaustive list.


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Originally Posted by AZRWinger View Post
Obama rarely discusses, he issues remarks or reads a speech from the teleprompter. Obviously Obama sought to expand the definition of racial profiling to include people locking their car doors or looking at black men with suspicion for the purpose of agitating resentments.
You keep quibbling over whether those can be classified as "racial profiling" but you fail to admit to a more simple point that those issues can be examples of racism.


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Originally Posted by AZRWinger View Post
Using the definition that makes sense, yes the police do practice racial profiling but it is rare.
Claiming it is "rare" is false. Racial profiling and racial inequality in our justice system is pervasive in the system. From stopping and questioning to sentencing, blacks habitually get the short end of the stick.
The NY example is a demonstration of a large example, but it's a drop in the bucket.


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Originally Posted by AZRWinger View Post
The question is terribly patronizing to women.
I'm not asking for your obfuscation.
I'm not claiming it's 100% true of all women.
I'm asking for you to acknowledge the reality of a hypothetical which is very true for many women in the U.S.

Once again, you refuse to answer the question.
Do you think that if a woman fears for being raped / robbed by a black man, in a situation where a white man would not invoke the same fear, that isn't "racism" ???

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Originally Posted by AZRWinger View Post
Now my turn to ask a question relevant to the thread. Should Zimmerman allowed Martin to continue beating him in the interest of avoiding frustration in the black community?
That's a stupid question.
No. Nobody is intimating an answer of yes.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Dog Man
Yep, I answer questions for people that can't.
You can't seriously think that others "can't" answer that question.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dog Man
In Chicago 5 cops in riot gear were afraid for their lives when a 95 year old threatened them with a shoe horn, they shot him point blank with a bean bag round that killed him. But Zimmerman should have been OK with a guy on his chest raining down blows.
Ooohhh.
The two wrongs make it right argument.
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  #216 (permalink)  
Old 08-06-2013, 11:25 AM
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Default Re: Obama: Trayvon Martin 'could have been me'

I am not a partisan hack so I can see how what I think about Z and Martin could confuse you. I do not think there was enough evidence to convict Zimmerman on, so a not guilty finding was corret. I also think people get beat up worse all the time and dont kill anybody. It is absolutely not a slam dunk Z did nothing wrong, it is just that there was not enough evidnce to convict him on. I really dont care about Obama's remarks, I have my own opinions, try it sometime, it is really kinda cool to think for yourself once in a while. I do think race played a big part in this case. MSNBC or whichever one is was seen the name Zimmerman and tried to make it a race thing with a white guy shooting a minority. Not to be outdone, Faux heard about a gun case with a guy named Zimmerman and was all in before they realized he was hispanic. Had his name been Garcia we would have never heard of this case. After faux and far RWers were all in they could not say it was a weak case, lets see how the evidence turns out, it was too late. Now Z is a RW superhero with fund drives and stuff. It only cant be both ways when you are a mindless partisan hack. I am not that big a Obama fan, but I really really hate the mindless stupidity from the right. It never ends.
Quote:
Originally Posted by AZRWinger View Post
If you think the verdict was appropriate, why do you defend Obama's race baiting remarks based on the verdict? It cannot be both ways, either the verdict was correct or the President spoke out against the injustice.
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  #217 (permalink)  
Old 08-06-2013, 11:28 AM
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Post Re: Obama: Trayvon Martin 'could have been me'

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Originally Posted by Dog Man View Post
I ask the questions that you don't ask. All you do is tell us what is wrong, if you don't ask questions you don't learn anything.
Honestly, I'm trying to get people to honestly ACKNOWLEDGE the problem.
That's the first step in problem solving.
In my experience, the Republicans obfuscate the living %@#$ out of the problem and refuse to admit it is a problem.

Can you admit it is a problem?
Cause if you can't, there is no point in talking "solutions" when you refuse to acknowledge it's a problem.
(Caveat: UNLESS they can tie it to Obama. THEN a problem is acknowledge if they can blame him. Otherwise, it's not a problem to them...)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dog Man View Post
Maybe you should try it sometime. Don't blame republicans.
Where did I blame the Republicans?


See? You're already trying to OBFUSCATE my statements instead of simply acknowledging them.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Dog Man View Post
blame the friggin NEA if you don't like our education system. The simple fact is, ANYBODY can do ANYTHING they put their mind to in this country.

And more obfuscation.
As I've pointed out, our American workers work harder. We've got some of the best education systems in the world, and that's why people of different countries try to come here to go to our Universities.

And without surprise, you try to obfuscate onto another Republican target, without even looking to see if that's actually an issue to the problem.
WHY do you think the NEA is responsible for this problem?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Dog Man View Post
My wife and I are perfect examples. We could have wasted away and we both had good reasons, but we have both worked our asses off and made it pretty damn good with ZERO help from family or Government. people do rise up by there own boot straps, you cannot legislate success. Look I don't like seeing CEO get million dollar bonuses from failing companies either, But at least they are not using tax dollars.
Yeah. They WERE attempting to use our tax dollars for bonuses for failing companies.
Remember when the bailout was happening and Democrats were fighting to ensure that the bailouts did NOT include bonuses? Cause there were a variety of examples where the company CEOs were WANTING some of the money to go to bonuses?
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Last edited by foundit66; 08-06-2013 at 12:37 PM..
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  #218 (permalink)  
Old 08-06-2013, 12:48 PM
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Default Re: Obama: Trayvon Martin 'could have been me'

No more racial profiling HATE everyone equally!
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