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Open Discussion Discuss What would a socialist America look like. at the General Forum; Originally Posted by WallyWager Realistically it wouldn't look much different from now. We'll never have an actual, seize-the-means and eat-the-rich, ...

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  #41 (permalink)  
Old 10-21-2019, 11:15 AM
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Default Re: What would a socialist America look like.

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Originally Posted by WallyWager View Post
Realistically it wouldn't look much different from now.

We'll never have an actual, seize-the-means and eat-the-rich, centralized command economy socialism. No major candidate for president supports that, and there's likely no one in Congress that does either. Supporters outside DC are still on the fringe.

What is much more likely is something akin to a hybrid of Nordic/Western Europe and the current state of things here. And that's not socialism either, closer to a social democracy wherein you'd still have a strong free market that's a bit more regulated, and a better welfare state that would cover things like healthcare and childcare. Medicare-for-all, universal pre-K, more solvency for social security, and labor unions wouldn't turn America into Venezuela, nor would it end innovation or the American "can-do" spirit.
Thank's for that answer Wally. It all sounds good, but I believe once a Liz or Bernie type gets elected, Trillions of dollars will be lost in the markets overnight, and everyone with money will stop spending while waiting for the impending high taxes and MEGA regulations.

This will throw us into a Recession much worse than 2008, possibly a Depression. The left knows this, and they will be able to get much more aggressive about government intervention and socialistic reform.

Our current booming economy will only last if Republicans remain power.
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Old 10-21-2019, 12:54 PM
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Default Re: What would a socialist America look like.

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Originally Posted by AZRWinger View Post
Not much different under socialism? You must be joking.

Bernie Sanders and AOC proclaimed billionaires ought to not be allowed to exist in the US. Elizabeth Warren is less direct declaring the rich will pay more for Medicare for all and an assets tax creating a renter society instead of an ownership one.

In the Democrat debate socialist programs like Medicare for all with private insurance outlawed, free college, government child care and a government acting to promote union interests, as well as full social welfare benefits for all current and future illegal aliens. The health care piece alone is 18% of the US economy. That's not a little bit of socialism.
In many countries of the world, the ruling class is the mega rich. Most of these nations are socialists. Bernie's idea that in socialism, the billionaires should be outlawed is, in a practical matter, not proven to be so. Anywhere!
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Old 10-22-2019, 02:50 AM
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Default Re: What would a socialist America look like.

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Originally Posted by Dog Man View Post
Thank's for that answer Wally. It all sounds good, but I believe once a Liz or Bernie type gets elected, Trillions of dollars will be lost in the markets overnight, and everyone with money will stop spending while waiting for the impending high taxes and MEGA regulations.

This will throw us into a Recession much worse than 2008, possibly a Depression. The left knows this, and they will be able to get much more aggressive about government intervention and socialistic reform.

Our current booming economy will only last if Republicans remain power.
mega rich dont up our sales much anyway. WE do. me and you and millions of middle to lower class people. why do i give a flying z if markets tank? they are not based on American income anymore but global players. the guy at the local hardware just opened in the new grocery store here that rebuilt after our snow cave in 2 yrs ago. I hear he's doing quite well. he's not a public company/
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Old 10-22-2019, 02:52 AM
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Default Re: What would a socialist America look like.

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Originally Posted by AZRWinger View Post
Once again, you spout gibberish
fact
look it up
I dare you
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Old 10-22-2019, 03:14 AM
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Default Re: What would a socialist America look like.

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Originally Posted by FrancSevin View Post
Getting rid of billionaires is not an element of practical socialism. Billionaires exist in socialist countries all over the world. China, Russia, Sweden, Denmark, are full of them.
China, Russia, are NOT, I repeat not socialist countries.
they are oligarchies

Who is getting rid of billionaires?
certainly not warren; she wants to tax them after their first 2 million dollars.
but say they do want this yes it would be better than what we have been heading toward since the 80s. another oligarchy.
the fact there are like 8 people who own more assets real property and money than the entire rest of the country begs for a re-do.
maybe laws against wealth is not the answer but certainly, we need some regulation on entities that can and do control our media, our domestic and foreign policies. We the people should do that through our reps WITHOUT the influence of outsiders and specific businesses over others.
maybe we'd have safer airplanes if Boeing didn't do its own inspections. maybe fewer outbreaks of ecoli if meat and veg packers were really inspected with authority.
maybe fewer explosions if chem and oil plants were regulated.
maybe less sht for news if two billionaires didn't own all tv news.
maybe more variety if the same two didn't buy up all the radio slots, command advertising and available goods.
a better chance at the American dream if these bored billionaire muther ruckers didn't have emperor like control over all our lives.
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Old 10-22-2019, 11:09 AM
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Default Re: What would a socialist America look like.

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Originally Posted by saltwn View Post
mega rich dont up our sales much anyway. WE do. me and you and millions of middle to lower class people. why do i give a flying z if markets tank? they are not based on American income anymore but global players. the guy at the local hardware just opened in the new grocery store here that rebuilt after our snow cave in 2 yrs ago. I hear he's doing quite well. he's not a public company/
Millions of middle income and low income people rely on some type of retirement that feeds off the markets. When the markets tank, they lose that money.
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Old 10-22-2019, 10:20 PM
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Default Re: What would a socialist America look like.

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Originally Posted by saltwn View Post
China, Russia, are NOT, I repeat not socialist countries.
they are oligarchies

Who is getting rid of billionaires?
certainly not warren; she wants to tax them after their first 2 million dollars.
but say they do want this yes it would be better than what we have been heading toward since the 80s. another oligarchy.
the fact there are like 8 people who own more assets real property and money than the entire rest of the country begs for a re-do.
maybe laws against wealth is not the answer but certainly, we need some regulation on entities that can and do control our media, our domestic and foreign policies. We the people should do that through our reps WITHOUT the influence of outsiders and specific businesses over others.
maybe we'd have safer airplanes if Boeing didn't do its own inspections. maybe fewer outbreaks of ecoli if meat and veg packers were really inspected with authority.
maybe fewer explosions if chem and oil plants were regulated.
maybe less sht for news if two billionaires didn't own all tv news.
maybe more variety if the same two didn't buy up all the radio slots, command advertising and available goods.
a better chance at the American dream if these bored billionaire muther ruckers didn't have emperor like control over all our lives.
A convenient re-definition. And a non siquitur to the matter at hand. Fact, every Socialist nation, even by your extreme definition, is full of millionaires and billionaires.

As for Russia, Bernie, who honeymooned there, considers their government socialist enough to support the model in his politics. People with money and power in Russia are still the rich ruling class, no matter the title you apply.
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  #48 (permalink)  
Old 10-23-2019, 01:02 AM
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Default Re: What would a socialist America look like.

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Originally Posted by Dog Man View Post
Millions of middle income and low income people rely on some type of retirement that feeds off the markets. When the markets tank, they lose that money.
and as soon as a large group comes near retirement guess what happens?
do better if they quit manipulating interest for big banks and we had a decent return on savings.
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  #49 (permalink)  
Old 10-23-2019, 01:07 AM
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Default Re: What would a socialist America look like.

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Originally Posted by FrancSevin View Post
A convenient re-definition. And a non siquitur to the matter at hand. Fact, every Socialist nation, even by your extreme definition, is full of millionaires and billionaires.

As for Russia, Bernie, who honeymooned there, considers their government socialist enough to support the model in his politics. People with money and power in Russia are still the rich ruling class, no matter the title you apply.
russia is no longer communist or socialist or whatever they climed they were. it is an oligarchy.
I don't care where Bernie spent his honeymoon. but in 1988 Russia was certainly a hopeful and very different place than poo ton's dictatorship.
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Old 10-23-2019, 11:06 AM
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Default Re: What would a socialist America look like.

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Originally Posted by saltwn View Post
and as soon as a large group comes near retirement guess what happens?
do better if they quit manipulating interest for big banks and we had a decent return on savings.
What happens??? Two things could happen.

1. The money stays in investments and eventually goes to the heirs.

2. They spend that money, and it goes back in circulating.

Both are good for the country in different ways.

Are you happy that interest rates have gone up under Trump?
If Hillary was in office they would be ZERO like they were under Obama.

A strong economy is what drives those rates up. You should be backing Trumps policies if that is what you want.
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