Declaration Of Independence - Page 7

aaronssongs · #61 (**permalink**) 07-12-2008, 05:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cnredd

I said no such thing...

Quote:

And he'll go rabid when you point out that America was more than humane with their slaves

You might not have said it, but others would seek to minimize the tragedy, inhumanity and the resulting outrage.

cnredd · #62 (**permalink**) 07-12-2008, 05:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cnredd

I said no such thing...

Quote:

Originally Posted by aaronssongs

You might not have said it, but others would seek to minimize the tragedy, inhumanity and the resulting outrage.

Then discuss it with them and don't include me in your accusations...

aaronssongs · #63 (**permalink**) 07-12-2008, 05:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cnredd

While I agree with what you've said, I still can't fathom people believing that a social issue is worth the destruction of national security and self defense...

I want the BEST person to be president...If the next 5 are black, women, gay, or otherwise, I'm all for it...as long as they are the BEST...

And I will NEVER sacrifice the best person so we can sit here and pat ourselves on the back thinking we helped the cause of diversity for the sake of the country...

The best person? And who might that be? John McCain? Bob Barr? Ralph Nader?
Diversity? If not now, when?
2030? 2060? If we use your logic...it will never happen. You can talk all that sugar and spice, but if you can't see that Obama is so much better than George Bush...who presented opportunity after opportunity to impeach his stupid ass, but no one found anything he did so grievous as to follow through...and you want to hold him in higher esteem than Barack Obama?
You put up with his bungling, his cluelessness, and his rape of the Constitution for nigh going on 8 years, and you cannot afford Obama a shot at the damn thing for 4 years....look around you. open your eyes. we are in deep doo doo. And you and people like you allowed it to happen.
Obama may not be the best choice.....but he could do far from worse.

aaronssongs · #64 (**permalink**) 07-12-2008, 05:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cnredd

Then discuss it with them and don't include me in your accusations...

I'm not discussing anything with anyone who has publicly disrespected me...and who did so with impunity.
But he's on your bandwagon, not mine....talking nonsense.
Y'all are patting each other on the back....about injustice. and more of the same.
How admirable.

Idealogically Promiscuous · #65 (**permalink**) 07-12-2008, 06:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aaronssongs

I'm not discussing anything with anyone who has publicly disrespected me...and who did so with impunity.
But he's on your bandwagon, not mine....talking nonsense.
Y'all are patting each other on the back....about injustice. and more of the same.
How admirable.

I think somebody didn't like having a taste of his own medicine thrown back at him.

saltwn · #66 (**permalink**) 07-12-2008, 12:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aaronssongs

America is strikingly similar to Iran, in that, the leadership could not be more "misguided"....I think Iran's leadership is misguided.do you really think that the Iranian people are much different from the American people? No, absolutely not....people, when you get right down to it, are just "that".....people....with the same aspirations, same needs and wants, as everyone else. No. It's governments that are at fault, The government of Iran wants to increase its capacity for nuclear weapons.and that will be our ruin. Do you not think America and the rest of the free world should be concerned over nuclear weapon proliferation from a known enemy. Actually at least two foreign enemies?
Think about the last 8 years....are you any better off? Is anyone better off, than they were? Hardly. Just open your eyes and look around...you don't even have to open your eyes...just feel the heat, and smell the air.
What? The truth bothers you? I did not vote for George Bush, but he is the President of the U.S. He had to make decisions based on 9-11 and on terrorist cell discoveries and other intelligence from our sources. Let me put it this way. The day I saw the news regarding the American ex patriot who had joined the opposition rebel forces, I told my family who are still mostly democrat that this was not about liberal vs. conservative. Because we had been attacked and were-are-at war, if we pick the wrong side, we will live to regret it. I back George Bush all the way as far as the war on terrorism and bringing nuclear proliferation under control.
I don't have a chip on my shoulder. How dare you assume that I do. Projecting attitudes....ever since I've been on this site, only one or no more than three people have ever commented in a civilized manner to meAnd I believe I was one of them....and you think I have the problem?
I've been insulted, and when I have responded, in kind, I wound up "banned for 7 days"...while the perpetrator still lashes out, at will, and nothing is done or said. Not going to address that as I am more interested in the subject at hand.
No wonder we're in the sad shape that we're in, precisely because there are people who view life completely from a vacuum, and rely solely on what they have been told about others, instead of investigating for themselves....they call it "brainwashing". 1984 is right here and right now. Big Brother is watching, and you don't give a care. If you like it, I love it....for you...but not for me. Wow, just wrap everything up in one big conspiracy and give it to yourself for Christmas.
I get on these forums, and I vent...Thanks a lot! and afterwards I feel better...it allows me to enjoy the quietude, which I need to recharge my batteries, after they've been drained by people, out there, in the world, who feel it's their bounden duty to rain on peoples' parades, and to snatch their joy. I'm over it...I put on my music, mostly jazz, and I forget that there are stupid, uncaring people in the world. I cook, write poetry, work on my music and laugh as often as possible. I'm fine.....you might want to get a reality check yourself.

I truly wish you happiness and blessings.

aaronssongs · #67 (**permalink**) 07-12-2008, 01:11 PM

[quote=saltwn;33753] ..

Quote:

.I think Iran's leadership is misguided.

Well, thanks for joining the club.

Quote:

The government of Iran wants to increase its capacity for nuclear weapons.and that will be our ruin. Do you not think America and the rest of the free world should be concerned over nuclear weapon proliferation from a known enemy. Actually at least two foreign enemies?

Of course we should be concerned....but we've had 8 years of unwillingness on the part of the Bush administration to sit down and talk, diplomatically, and now it has escalated to this...who would you blame for being stubborn and arrogant? The Iranians? Try stepping outside of your little prim box, and put yourself in their shoes. The bully on the proverbial block wouldn't be them. The war in Iraq was a "god-send" to some, who have been waiting for the excuse to get a foothold in the region for years (even on a "trumped-up" charge)...oh, and the profits....can't you just see it....The Iraqi people?????
Just mere collateral damage. How greedy and inhumane can we possibly be?
The emperor has no clothes on, but you better not tell him.
Mighty funny we didn't rattle our sabers at North Korea? Or India. Or Pakistan. Or China. They all have nuclear capabilities. What Up???? Why do you suppose that is? Please enlighten me. Because it was a "show war"...except it turned into Vietnam II.

Quote:

I did not vote for George Bush, but he is the President of the U.S. He had to make decisions based on 9-11 and on terrorist cell discoveries and other intelligence from our sources. Let me put it this way. The day I saw the news regarding the American ex patriot who had joined the opposition rebel forces, I told my family who are still mostly democrat that this was not about liberal vs. conservative. Because we had been attacked and were-are-at war, if we pick the wrong side, we will live to regret it. I back George Bush all the way as far as the war on terrorism and bringing nuclear proliferation under control.

[BSBSBSBSBSBSBSBSBSBSBSBSBSBSBSBSBSBSBSBSBSBSBSBSBS BSBSBS
The biggest crock in the world. That's what we were told...and you believed it.
So what's worse....the Bush Administration "lying"...or you believing the "lie"???

Quote:

I don't have a chip on my shoulder. How dare you assume that I do. Projecting attitudes....ever since I've been on this site, only one or no more than three people have ever commented in a civilized manner to me

Quote:

And I believe I was one of them

.
And with friends like you...who needs enemies, they say.
I've been insulted, and when I have responded, in kind, I wound up "banned for 7 days"...while the perpetrator still lashes out, at will, and nothing is done or said.

Quote:

Not going to address that as I am more interested in the subject at hand.

Of course not....fairness doesn't count. Or let's say, some folks are "better connected".

No wonder we're in the sad shape that we're in, precisely because there are people who view life completely from a vacuum, and rely solely on what they have been told about others, instead of investigating for themselves....they call it "brainwashing". 1984 is right here and right now. Big Brother is watching, and you don't give a care. If you like it, I love it....for you...but not for me.

Quote:

Wow, just wrap everything up in one big conspiracy and give it to yourself for Christmas.

You were the one who fell for the machinations of Bush/Cheney, not me...the last laugh would be on you, my dear.
I get on these forums, and I vent...Thanks a lot! and afterwards I feel better...it allows me to enjoy the quietude, which I need to recharge my batteries, after they've been drained by people, out there, in the world, who feel it's their bounden duty to rain on peoples' parades, and to snatch their joy. I'm over it...I put on my music, mostly jazz, and I forget that there are stupid, uncaring people in the world. I cook, write poetry, work on my music and laugh as often as possible. I'm fine.....you might want to get a reality check yourself.
I truly wish you happiness and blessings.

I wish you the same.

bossfan · #68 (**permalink**) 07-12-2008, 01:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aaronssongs

I'm not discussing anything with anyone who has publicly disrespected me...and who did so with impunity.
But he's on your bandwagon, not mine....talking nonsense.
Y'all are patting each other on the back....about injustice. and more of the same.
How admirable.

Concerning the injustice:

Quote:

The Founding Fathers and Slavery
David Barton

Even though the issue of slavery is often raised as a discrediting charge against the Founding Fathers, the historical fact is that slavery was not the product of, nor was it an evil introduced by, the Founding Fathers; slavery had been introduced to America nearly two centuries before the Founders. As President of Congress Henry Laurens explained:

I abhor slavery. I was born in a country where slavery had been established by British Kings and Parliaments as well as by the laws of the country ages before my existence. . . . In former days there was no combating the prejudices of men supported by interest; the day, I hope, is approaching when, from principles of gratitude as well as justice, every man will strive to be foremost in showing his readiness to comply with the Golden Rule ["do unto others as you would have them do unto you" Matthew 7:12]. (1)
Prior to the time of the Founding Fathers, there had been few serious efforts to dismantle the institution of slavery. John Jay identified the point at which the change in attitude toward slavery began:

Prior to the great Revolution, the great majority . . . of our people had been so long accustomed to the practice and convenience of having slaves that very few among them even doubted the propriety and rectitude of it. (2)

Read the full article: WallBuilders - Issues and Articles - The Founding Fathers and Slavery

This article comes complete with a lot of footnotes, so read it carefully for yourself, doubt it all you want, and then look up the sources to see if it's true.

*Let's learn the history of our Founding Fathers from the words of the Founding Fathers themselves, and the people who personally knew them. There are volumes and volumes of writings and documents from them available waiting to be discovered by a generation (us) who have instead received our education about them from people who lived and wrote about them over 100 years after their passing! Go to the source....

aaronssongs · #69 (**permalink**) 07-12-2008, 02:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bossfan

Concerning the injustice:

Read the full article: WallBuilders - Issues and Articles - The Founding Fathers and Slavery

This article comes complete with a lot of footnotes, so read it carefully for yourself, doubt it all you want, and then look up the sources to see if it's true.

*Let's learn the history of our Founding Fathers from the words of the Founding Fathers themselves, and the people who personally knew them. There are volumes and volumes of writings and documents from them available waiting to be discovered by a generation (us) who have instead received our education about them from people who lived and wrote about them over 100 years after their passing! Go to the source....

I'm sorry, but I'm not buying the premise of "passing the buck"...because slavery was an established enterprise and hugely profitable, does not excuse its' wrongness.
It's just like the Jimmy Swaggerts and Jim Bakkers of the world, despite the good that they did, they f'ed up, and lost complete credibility. So what.
I'm supposed to go to "the source" and read their justifications for the abuse and enslavement of human beings, that cannot be justified by any standard?
No, thank you.

AmericanDreamer · #70 (**permalink**) 07-12-2008, 02:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aaronssongs

If we use your logic...it will never happen. You can talk all that sugar and spice, but if you can't see that Obama is so much better than George Bush...who presented opportunity after opportunity to impeach his stupid ass, but no one found anything he did so grievous as to follow through...and you want to hold him in higher esteem than Barack Obama?

Update....it's 2008....Bush is not running for President...Obama is. Sounds like you need to have a better understanding of what the impeachment process is all about.

Quote:

Originally Posted by aaronssongs

Obama may not be the best choice.....but he could do far from worse.

I agree. Obama may not be the best choice. At least you admit that.

Sounds like the only reason you will vote for Obama is because he's black. You have no clue as to what exactly he will do if elected because he really doesn't say mauch about it. After he secured the Dem nomination he seemed to flip-flop on his promises. You have no clue as to what he is capable of.

Have you ever really given some intelligent thought to his lifelong associations and how they have influenced his life and ideology?? Take a closer look at the Rezkos, Wrights, and Ayers in his life. And with all this "anti-American" rhetoric that his buddies speak, what do you think will happen to American values and the Constitution once he is elected (if that day comes)? Obama is a Marxist liberal that will take America down the wrong path.

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