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Open Discussion Discuss Govít says wood is illegal if U.S. workers produce it at the General Forum; YHGTBFKM.............. Thursday, August 25, 2011 The Justice department bullies Gibson without filing charges The Federal Department of Justice in Washington, ...

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Old 08-27-2011, 03:59 PM
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Default Govít says wood is illegal if U.S. workers produce it

YHGTBFKM..............





Thursday, August 25, 2011

The Justice department bullies Gibson without filing charges

The Federal Department of Justice in Washington, D.C. has suggested that the use of wood from India that is not finished by Indian workers is illegal, not because of U.S. law, but because it is the Justice Department’s interpretation of a law in India. (If the same wood from the same tree was finished by Indian workers, the material would be legal.) This action was taken without the support and consent of the government in India.

On August 24, 2011, around 8:45 a.m. CDT, agents for the federal government executed four search warrants on Gibson’s facilities in Nashville and Memphis and seized several pallets of wood, electronic files and guitars. Gibson had to cease its manufacturing operations and send workers home for the day, while armed agents executed the search warrants. Gibson has fully cooperated with the execution of the search warrants.

• Raid shut down Gibson factories and cost company money
This is the second time that federal agents have raided Gibson facilities and disrupted production – this time causing lost productivity and sales.

• Wood seized was Forest Stewardship Council Controlled
The wood the Government seized on August 24 is from a Forest Stewardship Council certified supplier and is FSC Controlled, meaning that the wood complies with the standards of the Forest Stewardship Council, which is an industry-recognized and independent, not-for-profit organization established to promote responsible management of the world’s forests. FSC Controlled Wood standards require, among other things, that the wood not be illegally harvested and not be harvested in violation of traditional and civil rights. See FSC:Startpage-Forest Stewardship Council for more information. Gibson has a long history of supporting sustainable and responsible sources of wood and has worked diligently with entities such as the Rainforest Alliance and Greenpeace to secure FSC certified supplies. The wood seized on August 24 satisfied FSC standards.

• Nearly two years later, no charges have been filed
In 2009, more than a dozen agents with automatic weapons invaded the Gibson factory in Nashville. The Government seized guitars and a substantial amount of ebony fingerboard blanks from Madagascar. To date, 1 year and 9 months later, criminal charges have NOT been filed, yet the Government still holds Gibson’s property. Gibson has obtained sworn statements and documents from the Madagascar government and these materials, which have been filed in federal court, show that the wood seized in 2009 was legally exported under Madagascar law and that no law has been violated. Gibson is attempting to have its property returned in a civil proceeding that is pending in federal court.

The Justice Department has asked the judge to stop the court case indefinitely.

• Information sought in raid was already made available
Since 2009, Gibson has fully cooperated with the Government’s investigation of wood and has provided substantial documentation regarding Gibson’s wood-buying activities over the years. Yet, the Federal Government raided Gibson’s facilities on August 24, 2011, without warning or communication of any kind. Had the Government simply communicated with Gibson, Gibson would have cooperated without having to stop its production and send workers home.

• Not about illegal logging, not about conservation, not about the environment
The U.S. Lacey Act does not directly address conservation issues but is about obeying all laws of the countries from which wood products are procured. This law reads that you are guilty if you did not observe a law even though you had no knowledge of that law in a foreign country. The U.S. Lacey Act is only applicable when a foreign law has been violated.

• Gibson is innocent and will fight to protect its rights
Gibson has complied with foreign laws and believes it is innocent of ANY wrong doing. We will fight aggressively to prove our innocence.

For more information, please contact:
Henry E. Juszkiewicz
c/o Gibson Guitar Corp.
309 Plus Park Blvd.
Nashville, TN 37217
(615) 871-4500 Extension 2405

Gibson Press Release
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Old 08-27-2011, 05:07 PM
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Default Re: Govít says wood is illegal if U.S. workers produce it

First, the laws Gibson are ACUSSED of breaking aren't American laws...Their Indian...The DoJ is running interference...

Second, WTF???...Blank Panthers with nightsticks get a free pass but they gotta crack down on the evil manufacturing plants in America????....
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Old 08-27-2011, 05:37 PM
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Default Re: Govít says wood is illegal if U.S. workers produce it

The whole situation sounds pretty freaking weird.

I would be curious to hear DOJ's side of it, because on the surface.......... it sounds utterly stupid.


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Old 08-27-2011, 06:09 PM
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Default Re: Govít says wood is illegal if U.S. workers produce it

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Originally Posted by cnredd View Post
First, the laws Gibson are ACUSSED of breaking aren't American laws...Their Indian...The DoJ is running interference...

Second, WTF???...Blank Panthers with nightsticks get a free pass but they gotta crack down on the evil manufacturing plants in America????....
Meanwhile, the government bitches about companies that send manufacturing offshore and pretends like they can "create jobs".
It's time to invent a new word.
Govtard ~ The act of or believing that foolish government actions are actually a benefit to society, more specifically so if based upon purely emotional reasoning.
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Old 08-27-2011, 06:35 PM
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Default Re: Govít says wood is illegal if U.S. workers produce it

Every time I've ever produced wood, it's been American made.



It just increases the enjoyment to think it might have been illegal..........
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Old 08-27-2011, 06:47 PM
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Default Re: Govít says wood is illegal if U.S. workers produce it

Making sense of it all...
http://www.commercialappeal.com/news...bson-searches/
Quote:
An air shipment of imported bundles of wood from India that arrived in Dallas two months ago -- without disclosing that Nashville's Gibson Guitar Corp. was their ultimate destination -- triggered the search warrants served by federal agents this week on Gibson facilities in Memphis and Nashville, according to court documents obtained Friday.
Quote:
A search warrant filed by a U.S. Fish & Wildlife Service special agent in federal court in Nashville discloses that the agents were looking for evidence that sawn ebony and rosewood from India, which that country does not allow to be exported under international trade regulations, has been smuggled into the United States for use by the Nashville-based guitar manufacturer.
Quote:
India does not allow wood to be exported if it is sawn or chipped lengthwise, sliced, peeled or more than 6 millimeters thick, the government contends in the court filing. The sawn ebony wood intercepted by U.S. customs agents in Dallas was 10 millimeters thick.
Quote:
Initial customs documents for the shipment falsely described the wood as veneer, less than 6 millimeters thick and finished parts of musical instruments, according to the court document.
Quote:
In addition, rather than listing Gibson as its ultimate consignee as required, California-based Luthier Mercantile International initially was declared to be the final destination for the wood, agents reported.
Quote:
data system tracking all imports to the U.S., showed 11 shipments of sawn ebony or rosewood from India bound for Gibson facilities in Memphis, Nashville or in Bozeman, Mont.

Agents also searched Red Arrow Delivery Service in Nashville, which receives and stores ocean cargo imports for Gibson, according to the search warrant.
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Old 08-27-2011, 06:49 PM
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Default Re: Govít says wood is illegal if U.S. workers produce it

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Originally Posted by lackluster View Post
Every time I've ever produced wood, it's been American made.
Except that one time with the Asian girl...
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Old 08-27-2011, 06:51 PM
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Default Re: Govít says wood is illegal if U.S. workers produce it

Hmmmmm..........another example of only getting part of the story.



(I know, I know...there will still be those who whine that it's still Obama's DOJ that's at fault).


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Old 08-27-2011, 06:53 PM
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Default Re: Govít says wood is illegal if U.S. workers produce it

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Originally Posted by AK Gandy View Post
Hmmmmm..........another example of only getting part of the story.



(I know, I know...there will still be those who whine that it's still Obama's DOJ that's at fault).


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'fraid so, Cowboy.
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Old 08-27-2011, 07:45 PM
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Default Re: Govít says wood is illegal if U.S. workers produce it

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Originally Posted by AK Gandy View Post
Hmmmmm..........another example of only getting part of the story.



(I know, I know...there will still be those who whine that it's still Obama's DOJ that's at fault).


.
Nope, just those (like you) that pretend that that will happen as a deflect to the real issue.
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