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Open Discussion Discuss Evidence of impending healthcare rationing at the General Forum; The term, "death panels," as coined by Sarah Palin (and subsequently used by countless others), is a bit too incendiary ...

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Old 11-18-2010, 11:44 PM
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Default Evidence of impending healthcare rationing

The term, "death panels," as coined by Sarah Palin (and subsequently used by countless others), is a bit too incendiary for my tastes.

Nonetheless, it appears that something approaching such panels is now in the works--even if a bit more polite of a term would be preferable.

Here is a bit from Forbes.com on the subject:

"In recent months there have been several troubling examples of the American government's move toward a more cost-obsessed health care system.

"Just look at the breast cancer drug Avastin. The Food and Drug Administration is considering rescinding approval of this drug for the treatment of advanced breast cancer.

"For many women with advanced breast cancer Avastin is a lifesaver. When combined with chemotherapy in the drug's critical phase III trial, Avastin increased progression-free survival for the average metastatic breast cancer patient by 5.5 months. However, averages don't tell the real story; a substantial minority had significantly longer-lasting benefits.

"A number of advocacy groups for patients with breast cancer have urged the FDA to maintain approval for this indication. But many have concluded--despite denials by those running the cancer drug section of the FDA--that the impending decision has been influenced by cost.

"The FDA's regulatory mandate does not include cost-benefit concerns. True, Avastin is certainly expensive--the drug can cost as much as $88,000 a year. If the FDA decides to rescind Avastin's approval for breast cancer, both private and government insurers could stop paying for treatment, and likely thousands of women could lose access to the drug, as it would be unaffordable."

But that is just one example of possible rationing in the near future.

Yet another example concerns an expensive prostate-cancer drug:

"Perhaps the most egregious example of government cost concerns getting in the way of treatment involves the cancer vaccine Provenge. In April of this year the FDA approved Provenge as a treatment for recurrence of prostate cancer. Although it's a one-time treatment, if carries a hefty price tag of $93,000.

"The Centers for Medicare and Medicaid Services are currently considering whether or not Provenge will be covered under government health insurance programs. If they decide not to, it will be the first time in history the agency has refused to cover an FDA-approved cancer treatment.

"Already the drug's path to approval has been mired in controversy. Indeed, Provenge was inexplicably stuck in the approval pipeline for years. This delay was tragic, given the fact that 30,000 American men die each year as a result of prostate cancer."

Here is the link to the full article: The British Health Care Invasion - Forbes.com
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Old 11-19-2010, 01:51 AM
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Default Re: Evidence of impending healthcare rationing

The irony here is that "Progressives" deny the actual "progression" that EVERY governmental system ends up with...

In 2009, they called Palin a liar...

In 2011, they'll spin the fact that she was telling the truth...
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Old 11-19-2010, 03:58 AM
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Default Re: Evidence of impending healthcare rationing

Quote:
Originally Posted by pjohns View Post
The term, "death panels," as coined by Sarah Palin (and subsequently used by countless others), is a bit too incendiary for my tastes.

Nonetheless, it appears that something approaching such panels is now in the works--even if a bit more polite of a term would be preferable.

Here is a bit from Forbes.com on the subject:

"In recent months there have been several troubling examples of the American government's move toward a more cost-obsessed health care system.

"Just look at the breast cancer drug Avastin. The Food and Drug Administration is considering rescinding approval of this drug for the treatment of advanced breast cancer.

"For many women with advanced breast cancer Avastin is a lifesaver. When combined with chemotherapy in the drug's critical phase III trial, Avastin increased progression-free survival for the average metastatic breast cancer patient by 5.5 months. However, averages don't tell the real story; a substantial minority had significantly longer-lasting benefits.

"A number of advocacy groups for patients with breast cancer have urged the FDA to maintain approval for this indication. But many have concluded--despite denials by those running the cancer drug section of the FDA--that the impending decision has been influenced by cost.

"The FDA's regulatory mandate does not include cost-benefit concerns. True, Avastin is certainly expensive--the drug can cost as much as $88,000 a year. If the FDA decides to rescind Avastin's approval for breast cancer, both private and government insurers could stop paying for treatment, and likely thousands of women could lose access to the drug, as it would be unaffordable."

But that is just one example of possible rationing in the near future.

Yet another example concerns an expensive prostate-cancer drug:

"Perhaps the most egregious example of government cost concerns getting in the way of treatment involves the cancer vaccine Provenge. In April of this year the FDA approved Provenge as a treatment for recurrence of prostate cancer. Although it's a one-time treatment, if carries a hefty price tag of $93,000.

"The Centers for Medicare and Medicaid Services are currently considering whether or not Provenge will be covered under government health insurance programs. If they decide not to, it will be the first time in history the agency has refused to cover an FDA-approved cancer treatment.

"Already the drug's path to approval has been mired in controversy. Indeed, Provenge was inexplicably stuck in the approval pipeline for years. This delay was tragic, given the fact that 30,000 American men die each year as a result of prostate cancer."

Here is the link to the full article: The British Health Care Invasion - Forbes.com
Like "they" don't ration it already. Sometimes they even ban it.
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Old 11-19-2010, 11:30 AM
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Default Re: Evidence of impending healthcare rationing

Quote:
Originally Posted by saltwn View Post
Like "they" don't ration it already. Sometimes they even ban it.
Exactly...
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Old 11-19-2010, 11:42 AM
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Default Re: Evidence of impending healthcare rationing

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Originally Posted by saltwn View Post
Like "they" don't ration it already. Sometimes they even ban it.
Since I recently worked for a doctor, I can tell you that you are exactly right. The insurance companies only have their bottom line in mind when they turn down (ration) treatments, meds, etc. I've had to talk to them many times to get approval for treatments, meds, etc. and they are brutal - even with the doctors in the "peer review" phone calls. I've heard my doctors slam down the phone after a peer review too many times!

They inundate the doctors with paperwork inquiring whether or not this is a pre-existing condition, even when the patient has been with the doctor for years and it's clear that it is not...as well as other stall tactics to keep from paying or to prevent the treatment/med that the doctor recommends.
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Old 11-19-2010, 02:48 PM
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Default Re: Evidence of impending healthcare rationing

No problem. I have a new doctor all lined up.


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Old 11-19-2010, 03:56 PM
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Default Re: Evidence of impending healthcare rationing

Quote:
Originally Posted by off the porch View Post
Since I recently worked for a doctor, I can tell you that you are exactly right. The insurance companies only have their bottom line in mind when they turn down (ration) treatments, meds, etc. I've had to talk to them many times to get approval for treatments, meds, etc. and they are brutal - even with the doctors in the "peer review" phone calls. I've heard my doctors slam down the phone after a peer review too many times!

They inundate the doctors with paperwork inquiring whether or not this is a pre-existing condition, even when the patient has been with the doctor for years and it's clear that it is not...as well as other stall tactics to keep from paying or to prevent the treatment/med that the doctor recommends.


The last time I was in the hospital I was flown by helicoptor (this was the second time), to a hospital better equipped to handle my case. Since our insurance paid for the flight the first time around, they refused to pay for the second trip and said the company was way overcharging their customers. So.......on that happy note, we ended up having to pay out of pocket $10,000 for a 45 minute flight to a larger hospital. That was a huge bite in our wallet.... The odd thing is that company had charged that same amount on the first trip and blue cross paid every penny of it. You'd think they would've complained to the helicoptor company when they got whacked the first time....
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Old 11-19-2010, 04:03 PM
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Default Re: Evidence of impending healthcare rationing

Quote:
Originally Posted by off the porch View Post
Since I recently worked for a doctor, I can tell you that you are exactly right. The insurance companies only have their bottom line in mind when they turn down (ration) treatments, meds, etc. I've had to talk to them many times to get approval for treatments, meds, etc. and they are brutal - even with the doctors in the "peer review" phone calls. I've heard my doctors slam down the phone after a peer review too many times!

They inundate the doctors with paperwork inquiring whether or not this is a pre-existing condition, even when the patient has been with the doctor for years and it's clear that it is not...as well as other stall tactics to keep from paying or to prevent the treatment/med that the doctor recommends.
Huge difference. If the FDA doesn't approve a drug, there's not a damn thing I can do about that. I can't go get it anyway.

If my insurance company refuses to pay for something or otherwise displeases me, I can drop them and either find a better one or pay out of pocket from then on out. (which we should all do anyway, insurance companies should all be put out of business)
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Old 11-19-2010, 07:24 PM
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Default Re: Evidence of impending healthcare rationing

Quote:
Originally Posted by rivrrat View Post
Huge difference. If the FDA doesn't approve a drug, there's not a damn thing I can do about that. I can't go get it anyway.

If my insurance company refuses to pay for something or otherwise displeases me, I can drop them and either find a better one or pay out of pocket from then on out. (which we should all do anyway, insurance companies should all be put out of business)
Not always possible.
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Old 11-19-2010, 09:29 PM
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Default Re: Evidence of impending healthcare rationing

Quote:
Originally Posted by saltwn View Post
Like "they" don't ration it already. Sometimes they even ban it.
What is the antecedent of "they" here?
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