Political Wrinkles  

Go Back   Political Wrinkles > General Forum > ObamaCare
Register FAQDonate PW Store PW Trivia Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

ObamaCare Discuss 49 should do it at the General Forum; My guess is that Republicans will need to get only to 49 votes, in order to pass their healthcare bill. ...

Reply
 
Share LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 06-27-2017, 11:23 AM
PW Enlightenment
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Tennessee
Gender: Male
Posts: 9,145
Thanks: 9,483
Thanked 3,671 Times in 2,408 Posts
Default 49 should do it

My guess is that Republicans will need to get only to 49 votes, in order to pass their healthcare bill.

Initially, anyway.

One may wonder just why this is--after all, it would require 50 votes (plus the vice-president's tie-breaker) to pass any legislation--but here is what I mean:

If Mitch McConnell can round up 49 votes, it is hard to see just how the holdouts could withstand the withering pressure that they would sustain: "Do you really want to be the person who leaves us with ObamaCare--and perhaps even eventually leads us to socialized medicine? Well, do you?"

The fiftieth vote should not be that hard to get (but probably not from Rand Paul, who is that most unusual of creatures: a principled politician), if the Republicans can just get to 49--and apparently without any Democratic help.
__________________
"In his second inaugural address, [Franklin D.] Roosevelt sought 'unimagined power' to enforce the 'proper subordination' of private power to public power. He got it…"—George Will, July 8, 2007

Last edited by pjohns; 06-27-2017 at 11:33 AM..
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 06-27-2017, 12:22 PM
WallyWager's Avatar
Moderator
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Michigan
Gender: Male
Posts: 11,156
Thanks: 1,528
Thanked 8,609 Times in 5,456 Posts
Default Re: 49 should do it

"Would you want to be the 50th vote to pass a 'healthcare bill' passed in secrecy with zero public input or amendments, 22 million to lose their insurance much of which includes 15 million poor folks on Medicaid and 4 million on employer sponsored insurance, older folks to see a major increase in their premiums and a general increase for everyone, thousands to tens of thousands to die sooner than they would have without the bill according to a number of studies, includes a penalty for a lapse in coverage which is the one thing a lot people really don't like about the ACA, opposed by the AMA, AARP, every major health care organization in the country, supported by only one 5th of the polled public?"

This bill doesn't fix any problems with the ACA and makes sh-t a lot worse.

And I know it's hard to hear to that folks will die if this bill passes, sounds like angry and vindictive rhetoric. And I know that no one in the House and the Senate wants to die, but this is the truth. You take 22 million off of insurance and anyone among those with a severe chronic condition that requires continues treatment is a risk at not being able to afford the care they need to live. This is serious.
__________________
"He's now president for life. President for life. And he's great," Trump said. "And look, he was able to do that. I think it's great. Maybe we'll give that a shot some day."
Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to WallyWager For This Useful Post:
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 06-27-2017, 12:24 PM
PW Enlightenment
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Gender: Male
Posts: 10,919
Thanks: 8,449
Thanked 6,965 Times in 4,218 Posts
Default Re: 49 should do it

Quote:
Originally Posted by pjohns View Post
My guess is that Republicans will need to get only to 49 votes, in order to pass their healthcare bill.

Initially, anyway.

One may wonder just why this is--after all, it would require 50 votes (plus the vice-president's tie-breaker) to pass any legislation--but here is what I mean:

If Mitch McConnell can round up 49 votes, it is hard to see just how the holdouts could withstand the withering pressure that they would sustain: "Do you really want to be the person who leaves us with ObamaCare--and perhaps even eventually leads us to socialized medicine? Well, do you?"

The fiftieth vote should not be that hard to get (but probably not from Rand Paul, who is that most unusual of creatures: a principled politician), if the Republicans can just get to 49--and apparently without any Democratic help.
You may have a point. Ideally, though no one would vote for this Obama lite fix nothing POS.

Or Ryan or McConnell for that matter.
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 06-28-2017, 01:38 PM
PW Enlightenment
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Tennessee
Gender: Male
Posts: 9,145
Thanks: 9,483
Thanked 3,671 Times in 2,408 Posts
Default Re: 49 should do it

Quote:
Originally Posted by WallyWager View Post
"Would you want to be the 50th vote to pass a 'healthcare bill' passed in secrecy with zero public input or amendments, 22 million to lose their insurance much of which includes 15 million poor folks on Medicaid and 4 million on employer sponsored insurance, older folks to see a major increase in their premiums and a general increase for everyone, thousands to tens of thousands to die sooner than they would have without the bill according to a number of studies, includes a penalty for a lapse in coverage which is the one thing a lot people really don't like about the ACA, opposed by the AMA, AARP, every major health care organization in the country, supported by only one 5th of the polled public?"

This bill doesn't fix any problems with the ACA and makes sh-t a lot worse.

And I know it's hard to hear to that folks will die if this bill passes, sounds like angry and vindictive rhetoric. And I know that no one in the House and the Senate wants to die, but this is the truth. You take 22 million off of insurance and anyone among those with a severe chronic condition that requires continues treatment is a risk at not being able to afford the care they need to live. This is serious.
This is a mere tirade against the Republicans' healthcare bill--absent any attempt to answer my question.

If you really wish to rant against this bill, then you are certainly free to start a thread of your own, in this regard.

But please do not attempt to hijack another thread. (I will gladly discuss the above matters with you--but not in this thread.)
__________________
"In his second inaugural address, [Franklin D.] Roosevelt sought 'unimagined power' to enforce the 'proper subordination' of private power to public power. He got it…"—George Will, July 8, 2007
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 06-28-2017, 02:45 PM
cnredd's Avatar
Administrator
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Philadelphia
Gender: Male
Posts: 52,938
Thanks: 2,041
Thanked 32,634 Times in 19,012 Posts
Default Re: 49 should do it

Quote:
Originally Posted by jimbo View Post
Ideally, though no one would vote for this Obama lite fix nothing POS.
Exactly...

I would be a "no" vote until the rest of the Republican hypocrites vote "yes" to the SAME DAMN repeal bill they voted for dozens of times while Obama was still president...
__________________
"You get the respect that you give" - cnredd
Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to cnredd For This Useful Post:
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 06-28-2017, 03:07 PM
ShivaTD's Avatar
Progressive Libertarian
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Immigrant to Arizona
Gender: Male
Posts: 6,209
Thanks: 1,438
Thanked 2,202 Times in 1,743 Posts
Default Re: 49 should do it

Quote:
Originally Posted by pjohns View Post
If Mitch McConnell can round up 49 votes, it is hard to see just how the holdouts could withstand the withering pressure that they would sustain: "Do you really want to be the person who leaves us with ObamaCare--and perhaps even eventually leads us to socialized medicine? Well, do you?"
That's a real easy question for a Republican to answer.

First of all the question is whether you want to be one of fifty people that takes away health insurance from over 20 million Americans.

Do you want to be one of fifty people that's ignoring two out of three Americans that want Obamacare fixed and not repealed.

Do you want to be one of fifty people that makes "age" a pre-existing condition because those over age 50 will never be able to afford the insurance rates that the Republican legislation will mandate?

Or more importantly.

If the Republicans pass the repeal of Obamacare with the current legislation then there's a 100% probability that we will have a socialized one-payer system in the future. There's no ifs, ands, or buts about that because it's going to leave more people uninsured and dying than ever before in the history of the United States and the PEOPLE are going to demand a single-payer system to stop the death toll that will rise every year because people that don't have health insurance do not get annual check-up so diseases that are curable if detected early won't be detected in time and the people will DIE.

In 2009 a study indicated that 45,000 people were dying of curable illnesses because they lacked insurance and therefore didn't get a routine annual exam that would have identified the illness in it's early curable stage.

That was with 30 million without insurance. With the Republican legislation we'll have 50 million without insurance and that number is going to rise annually as the population increases.

Bet your life on it. If the Republicans repeal Obamacare or intentionally force it to fail (like they've been trying to do since it passed) as opposed to fixing Obamacare then a single-payer system will be the next health care plan for America. Obamacare is the only thing preventing a single-payer system in America right now.

Remember how close we came to a single-payer system in 2010. The House version was single-payer but they had to accept the Senate version. The Democrats lost one vote in 2010 in the Senate and had it not been for one single Senator vote we'd already have a single-payer system.
__________________
"I always had a rule, if a restaurant is dirty on the outside, it's dirty on the inside." Donald Trump

"I always had a rule, if the White House is dirty on the inside, it's dirty on the outside." ShivaTD

Based upon the corruption, brutality, inhumanity, immorality, dishonesty, and incompetence of the Trump administration the White House is the dirtiest house in America and there's no known cleanser that with remove the stains of the Trump Administration.
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 06-28-2017, 03:22 PM
Lumara's Avatar
Belly Dance Queen
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Great Smoky Mountains
Gender: Female
Posts: 2,171
Thanks: 2,949
Thanked 2,698 Times in 1,315 Posts
Default Re: 49 should do it

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShivaTD View Post
First of all the question is whether you want to be one of fifty people that takes away health insurance from over 20 million Americans.
No, I believe the question is do we want government intervention to continue in the healthcare system? This intervention is what has caused costs to skyrocket ever since it was implemented.

Quote:
Do you want to be one of fifty people that makes "age" a pre-existing condition because those over age 50 will never be able to afford the insurance rates that the Republican legislation will mandate?
Do you want to continue to force some people to subsidize others? That's the question for me.

Quote:
If the Republicans repeal Obamacare or intentionally force it to fail
Nothing the GOP will do will force it to fail. Obamacare is already failing without anyone's help. This BS being spread around about 22 million losing insurance if the poorly-conceived, Obamacare Lite bill passes is ignoring how many already have been left without insurance as one insurance company or co-op after another has left.

Quote:
Remember how close we came to a single-payer system in 2010. The House version was single-payer but they had to accept the Senate version. The Democrats lost one vote in 2010 in the Senate and had it not been for one single Senator vote we'd already have a single-payer system.
And we see how well single-payer works with the VA. Government is extremely inefficient at running anything, and to believe it will miraculously fix healthcare by taking it over is typical liberal, rainbow-and-unicorn thinking with no basis in reality.
__________________
Fact: There is no such thing as banning abortion; there is only banning safe and legal abortion.
Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Lumara For This Useful Post:
  #8 (permalink)  
Old 06-28-2017, 04:28 PM
ShivaTD's Avatar
Progressive Libertarian
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Immigrant to Arizona
Gender: Male
Posts: 6,209
Thanks: 1,438
Thanked 2,202 Times in 1,743 Posts
Default Re: 49 should do it

Quote:
Originally Posted by cnredd View Post
Exactly...

I would be a "no" vote until the rest of the Republican hypocrites vote "yes" to the SAME DAMN repeal bill they voted for dozens of times while Obama was still president...
It's one thing to vote to make a political statement with no negative consequences. It's another thing to vote for legislation that you know will result in tens of thousands of Americans dying just to give a tax cut to wealthy people that already have more money than they can spend already.
__________________
"I always had a rule, if a restaurant is dirty on the outside, it's dirty on the inside." Donald Trump

"I always had a rule, if the White House is dirty on the inside, it's dirty on the outside." ShivaTD

Based upon the corruption, brutality, inhumanity, immorality, dishonesty, and incompetence of the Trump administration the White House is the dirtiest house in America and there's no known cleanser that with remove the stains of the Trump Administration.
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old 06-28-2017, 05:42 PM
WallyWager's Avatar
Moderator
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Michigan
Gender: Male
Posts: 11,156
Thanks: 1,528
Thanked 8,609 Times in 5,456 Posts
Default Re: 49 should do it

Quote:
Originally Posted by pjohns View Post
This is a mere tirade against the Republicans' healthcare bill--absent any attempt to answer my question.

If you really wish to rant against this bill, then you are certainly free to start a thread of your own, in this regard.

But please do not attempt to hijack another thread. (I will gladly discuss the above matters with you--but not in this thread.)
You didn't ask a question to us, apart from a hypothetical made towards a member of the Senate on the fence over their vote.

My point was that since the health care bill does hurt a lot of people at the expense of funding a tax cut for the wealthy, it is also a reasonable that a senator that doesn't know how to vote may be thinking of the harm it would cause people. "Would you want to be vote #50 that pulls the trigger for this abomination?"

Sen. Heller has voiced opposition to this bill because of how many Nevadans would be impacted by the cuts to Medicaid.
__________________
"He's now president for life. President for life. And he's great," Trump said. "And look, he was able to do that. I think it's great. Maybe we'll give that a shot some day."
Reply With Quote
  #10 (permalink)  
Old 06-28-2017, 05:47 PM
WallyWager's Avatar
Moderator
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Michigan
Gender: Male
Posts: 11,156
Thanks: 1,528
Thanked 8,609 Times in 5,456 Posts
Default Re: 49 should do it

Quote:
Originally Posted by cnredd View Post
Exactly...

I would be a "no" vote until the rest of the Republican hypocrites vote "yes" to the SAME DAMN repeal bill they voted for dozens of times while Obama was still president...
Well that was back when they knew it would be vetoed and wouldn't have to try anything beyond an empty political statement. Now that they actually are in charge, they don't know what to do. Hence, Bizzaro Obamacare: Where the subsides suck and people pay more, where a net 22 million lose coverage, premiums go up for older folks, and there's still a penalty for lapsed coverage. Kind of a strange half-repeal where the parts of healthcare people don't like get worse and the parts of the law they like get tremendously weakened.
__________________
"He's now president for life. President for life. And he's great," Trump said. "And look, he was able to do that. I think it's great. Maybe we'll give that a shot some day."
Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
should

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:53 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.2.0