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News & Current Events Discuss Coup Honduran president, seize palace at the General Forum; Originally Posted by Stinger He got all the due process he was allowed under their law as their court affirmed. ...

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  #81 (permalink)  
Old 07-16-2009, 03:44 PM
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Default Re: Coup Honduran president, seize palace

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Originally Posted by Stinger View Post
He got all the due process he was allowed under their law as their court affirmed.

He was trying to VIOLATE the constitution and illegally retain power.

He's gone, it's over. Obama was on the wrong side of justice and liberty.

Not necessarily.
I do not dispute that what he was trying to do was illegal (based on an amendment to the Constitution 4 days before the referendum). That does not take away from the fact that the coup was illegal as well. Like it or not, their own legal counsel admits it. If they had followed the correct procedure, they wouldn't be in the pickle they're in. Then again, they wouldn't have gotten rid of him either probably, so kudos to them - the illegal way might have been the only way. I can say that - as an independent citizen. Obama as President, cannot.

Now Zelaya is threatening taking back the Presidency by force - backed by Venezuela and I will assume by Nicaragua as well. So then what? The only amenable solution to this mess was to allow him back to finish his term without the referendum. I still fully believe Micheletti has every intention of doing so, AFTER the election. We'll see if they can hold off for that long.

Deposed Honduran president vows weekend 'activities' - CNN.com
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  #82 (permalink)  
Old 07-18-2009, 03:10 PM
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Default Re: Coup Honduran president, seize palace

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Originally Posted by dga View Post
That does not take away from the fact that the coup was illegal as well.
It was not only legal it was constitutional and necessary.

"In a perfect world former Honduran President Manuel Zelaya would be in jail in his own country right now, awaiting trial. The Honduran attorney general has charged him with deliberately violating Honduran law and the Supreme Court ordered his arrest in Tegucigalpa on June 28.

But the Honduran military whisked him out of the country, to Costa Rica, when it executed the court's order.......................


Besides eagerly trampling the constitution, Mr. Zelaya had demonstrated that he was ready to employ the violent tactics of chavismo to hang onto power. The decision to pack him off immediately was taken in the interest of protecting both constitutional order and human life.


Two incidents earlier this year make the case. The first occurred in January when the country was preparing to name a new 15-seat Supreme Court, as it does every seven years. An independent board made up of members of civil society had nominated 45 candidates. From that list, Congress was to choose the new judges.

Mr. Zelaya had his own nominees in mind, including the wife of a minister, and their names were not on the list. So he set about to pressure the legislature. On the day of the vote he militarized the area around the Congress and press reports say a group of the president's men, including the minister of defense, went to the Congress uninvited to turn up the heat. The head of the legislature had to call security to have the defense minister removed.

In the end Congress held its ground and Mr. Zelaya retreated. But the message had been sent: The president was willing to use force against other institutions.

In May there was an equally scary threat to peace issued by the Zelaya camp as the president illegally pushed for a plebiscite on rewriting the constitution. Since the executive branch is not permitted to call for such a vote, the attorney general had announced that he intended to enforce the law against Mr. Zelaya.

A week later some 100 agitators, wielding machetes, descended on the attorney general's office. "We have come to defend this country's second founding," the group's leader reportedly said. "If we are denied it, we will resort to national insurrection."

These experiences frightened Hondurans because they strongly suggested that Mr. Zelaya, who had already aligned himself with Mr. Chávez, was now emulating the Venezuelan's power-grab. Other Chávez protégés -- in Bolivia, Ecuador and Nicaragua -- have done the same, refusing to accept checks on their power, making use of mobs and seeking to undermine institutions."

Why Honduras Sent Zelaya Away - WSJ.com

The only question is why the military didn't throw him in prison and instead expelled him. But it is of little consequence.

He is no longer the President, there is nothing to negotiate with him. His power grab was thwarted, good riddence.

It's too bad Obama couldn't figure out which side to be on.

Quote:
Like it or not, their own legal counsel admits it.
Like it or not their own legislature and supreme court say otherwise.


Quote:
Now Zelaya is threatening taking back the Presidency by force - backed by Venezuela and I will assume by Nicaragua as well. So then what? The only amenable solution to this mess was to allow him back to finish his term without the referendum. I still fully believe Micheletti has every intention of doing so, AFTER the election. We'll see if they can hold off for that long.
And the United States should announce that it would view any such move by any other country as an illegal invasion and that we now stand behind the legitimate government of Hunduras.
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  #83 (permalink)  
Old 07-21-2009, 10:27 AM
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Default Results are in!!!!!!!!!!!

The results of former President Zelaya's referendum are in! And guess who won.

Zelaya

OF course since it never happened how did he win?

"Criminal investigators in Honduras have reportedly found computers containing the certified election results of the referendum which was to confirm Mel Zelaya as president for…however long he wanted to be president, I guess. Anyway, the certified results contained voting tallies, information about the voters, and other electoral information. An example:

One of the district attorneys that participated in the operation that took place this Friday showed reporters an official voting result from the Technical Institute Luis Bogran, of Tegucigalpa, in which the specific number of people that participated in table 345, where there were 550 ballots, 450 of which were votes in favor of Zelaya’s proposal and 30 were against, in addition to 20 blank ballots and 30 ballots, which were nullified.

That’s a very complete report of the election, and contains a wealth of details about the results that would be a credit to the authorities in charge of any election.

Of course, it would be even more impressive if the referendum had actually taken place.

There was no referendum. It was aborted by the legal, constitutional removal of Mr. Zelaya from power.

And yet, in the presidential palace’s computer, Mr. Zelaya apparently had a complete, certified result of an election that never took place.

If the Honduran authorities are to be believed, the evidence is that he had already completed a plan to steal the election, and the only remaining act to be performed was to conduct a sham referendum, whose results had already been determined.

Yet, this is the guy that the Obama Administration and the OAS thinks should be the legitimate leader of Honduras."

Certified Honduran Referendum Results Found | QandO

Are you guys still trying to defend this guy? He committed treason under their constitution and was removed from office.

Wonder if Acorn was helping him out?
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  #84 (permalink)  
Old 07-21-2009, 12:00 PM
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Default Re: Coup Honduran president, seize palace

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Originally Posted by Stinger View Post

And the United States should announce that it would view any such move by any other country as an illegal invasion and that we now stand behind the legitimate government of Hunduras.
This would not surprise me at all,
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  #85 (permalink)  
Old 07-21-2009, 12:13 PM
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Default Re: Results are in!!!!!!!!!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stinger View Post
The results of former President Zelaya's referendum are in! And guess who won.

Zelaya

OF course since it never happened how did he win?

"Criminal investigators in Honduras have reportedly found computers containing the certified election results of the referendum which was to confirm Mel Zelaya as president for…however long he wanted to be president, I guess. Anyway, the certified results contained voting tallies, information about the voters, and other electoral information. An example:

One of the district attorneys that participated in the operation that took place this Friday showed reporters an official voting result from the Technical Institute Luis Bogran, of Tegucigalpa, in which the specific number of people that participated in table 345, where there were 550 ballots, 450 of which were votes in favor of Zelaya’s proposal and 30 were against, in addition to 20 blank ballots and 30 ballots, which were nullified.

That’s a very complete report of the election, and contains a wealth of details about the results that would be a credit to the authorities in charge of any election.

Of course, it would be even more impressive if the referendum had actually taken place.

There was no referendum. It was aborted by the legal, constitutional removal of Mr. Zelaya from power.

And yet, in the presidential palace’s computer, Mr. Zelaya apparently had a complete, certified result of an election that never took place.

If the Honduran authorities are to be believed, the evidence is that he had already completed a plan to steal the election, and the only remaining act to be performed was to conduct a sham referendum, whose results had already been determined.

Yet, this is the guy that the Obama Administration and the OAS thinks should be the legitimate leader of Honduras."

Certified Honduran Referendum Results Found | QandO

Are you guys still trying to defend this guy? He committed treason under their constitution and was removed from office.

Wonder if Acorn was helping him out?
This isn't surprising at all. What is surprising, is the commentary. There was one question and one question only on the 'referendum':

¿Está de acuerdo que en las elecciones generales de 2009 se instale una cuarta urna en la cual el pueblo decida la convocatoria a una asamblea nacional constituyente? = Sí…….ó………..No.

Translation

Do you agree that in the 2009 General election a fourth ballot box be installed through which the people will decide to convene a constitutional assembly? Yes…….or………..No.

While following in the footsteps of his fellow left wing caudillos, nothing in this referendum would have extended his term - that would have been a multi-tiered process. This is a country where you can buy a 'witness' outside a courtroom... you can't believe everything you read.
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  #86 (permalink)  
Old 07-21-2009, 12:17 PM
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Default Re: Coup Honduran president, seize palace

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Originally Posted by Stinger View Post
He is no longer the President, there is nothing to negotiate with him. His power grab was thwarted, good riddence.
They're ALL power grabs. Right wing, left wing, socialist, comunist... all they want is to line their pockets, nothing else. The next one will be no better than this one - and all you will care about is how it affects you, .
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