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News & Current Events Discuss Here are the GOP defenses I have heard so far to articles of impeachment at the General Forum; Defense 1: Trump did nothing wrong. Response: Trump hit the trifecta of impeachable conduct by subverting an election, seeking foreign ...

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Old 12-16-2019, 01:11 AM
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Default Here are the GOP defenses I have heard so far to articles of impeachment

Defense 1: Trump did nothing wrong.

Response: Trump hit the trifecta of impeachable conduct by subverting an election, seeking foreign influence, and putting personal interest ahead of national interest. And he obstructed Congress by refusing to produce any witnesses or documents.


Defense 2. No harm occurred because the military aid went through.

Response: The aid went through only after Trump was caught. In the meantime, months of delay cost Ukraine lives in its war with Russia. US credibility was harmed and moral authority to fight corruption was eroded.


Defense 3: Because aid went through, no misconduct was committed.

Response: Bribery occurs upon demand for a personal favor in exchange for performance of an official act. If you offer a cop $20 to get out of a traffic ticket, even if he declines, you have still committed bribery


Defense 4: Abuse of power is not even a crime.

Response: Impeachable conduct may be criminal conduct, but need not be. A president could be impeached if he watched TV all day and failed to fulfill his constitutional duty to take care that the laws be faithfully executed.


Defense 5: There’s nothing wrong with asking for an investigation.

Response: If this were legitimate investigation, you wouldn’t need to send your personal lawyer and his henchmen to do it. Witnesses say Trump didn’t want investigation, just announcement of investigation.


Defense 6: There was no quid pro quo.

Response: Read the transcript! Trump’s request for a “favor” is strong evidence, corroborated by witness testimony, of months-long scheme to get Zelensky to “go to the mic” and announce Biden probe. Aid was leverage.


Defense 7: As VP, Biden held up aid as leverage to get rid of the Ukrainian public prosecutor.

Response: It is appropriate for a president or VP to take action to advance the interests of the nation. Trump was advancing his personal interests.


Defense 8: Testimony is hearsay.

Response: Rules of Evidence don’t apply. Also, call summary, Sondland testimony are non-hearsay. Trump has barred direct witnesses. You can’t have it both ways. If they had information favorable to Trump, you can bet we would have heard from them.


Defense 9: It happens all the time. Get over it.

Response: Trump sought foreign influence in our election and harmed national security by delaying aid designed to fight Russia, our adversary. We don’t have to accept it. We deserve better.


Defense 10: Impeachment would un-do an election.


Response: All impeachments un-do elections. Constitution permits impeachment if president is unfit to serve. When rigging an election is involved, elections are ineffective for removal. Impeachment is not to punish but to protect.


Defense 11: Impeachment proceedings are moving too fast.


Response: This impeachment has moved slower than Bill Clinton’s and on pace with Richard Nixon’s. For a president who presents a clear and present danger to national security, removal is urgent and can’t come soon enough.


Defense 12: We need to hear from the whistleblower.


Response: The whistleblower was a tipster, whose tip led to the investigation. Tipsters do not testify at trial, the witnesses do. We have a duty to protect whistleblowers to encourage them to use proper channels to report abuse


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Old 12-16-2019, 06:45 AM
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Default Re: Here are the GOP defenses I have heard so far to articles of impeachment

Number 1, Trump did nothing wrong. If an investigation is subverting an election, Democrats have loads to answer for. Joe Biden doesn't receive immunity because he is running for President especially after he coerced the Ukrainians into firing a prosecutor.

Turning the President's assertion of executive privilege into an impeachable offense is nonsense. Resistance Democrats have weaponized the subpoena power into a partisan tool of harassment not oversight. After John Bolton petitioned the court to resolve the conflict between Congress and the President the impeachment clown car of Democrat zealots dropped the subpoena so they could generate an impeachable offense.

The OP adds the rules of evidence to the bonfire of rights along with due process, the right to confront one's accuser, the right to legal representation and the presumption of innocence stoked by Resistance partisan hatred. When it comes to the bad Orange man the ends justify the means.

Conveniently missing from the OP is Nancy Pelosi's requirements for overwhelming evidence and bipartisan support for impeachment. It's easy to see why.
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Old 12-16-2019, 09:44 AM
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Default Re: Here are the GOP defenses I have heard so far to articles of impeachment

It is easy to refute each of the claims made in the OP, and I was about to, until I remembered it's a waste of time to cast pearls before swine.
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Old 12-16-2019, 10:23 AM
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Default Re: Here are the GOP defenses I have heard so far to articles of impeachment

Looks like it's taco time!
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Old 12-16-2019, 10:46 AM
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Default Re: Here are the GOP defenses I have heard so far to articles of impeachment

Actually, there is no logical defense or arguments for what Trump didn't do.

The left exonerated Hillary for what she did because they believe she didn't "intend" to do those crimes.
But they think Trump "intended" to do what he didn't do. So they charge him with the crimes.

For that,,, ;There is no defense.
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Old 12-16-2019, 11:25 AM
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Default Re: Here are the GOP defenses I have heard so far to articles of impeachment

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lumara View Post
It is easy to refute each of the claims made in the OP, and I was about to, until I remembered it's a waste of time to cast pearls before swine.
He just copies and pastes that stuff from left wing websites to stir the pot.

He believes absolutely EVERYTHING negative he hears about Trump, and then spreads it as if he knows it for a fact.

He pretends to know everyone's motivations, thoughts, and ideas.

Now if he could just do that with the resistance, he might know something real.
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Old 12-16-2019, 11:45 AM
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Default Re: Here are the GOP defenses I have heard so far to articles of impeachment

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lumara View Post
It is easy to refute each of the claims made in the OP, and I was about to, until I remembered it's a waste of time to cast pearls before swine.
I would agree. Virtually every response posted contains a lie or a conjecture of what was meant. For instance, Trump did not say .." do me a favor…" Implication being, that's what a Mafia Don might say. His actual words were "Do Us a favor." He was speaking for the American people.

As a President should.
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Old 12-16-2019, 11:49 AM
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Default Re: Here are the GOP defenses I have heard so far to articles of impeachment

Quote:
Originally Posted by FrancSevin View Post
I would agree. Virtually every response posted contains a lie or a conjecture of what was meant. For instance, Trump did not say .." do me a favor…" Implication being, that's what a Mafia Don might say. His actual words were "Do Us a favor." He was speaking for the American people.

As a President should.
The MSM knows that all they need to do is tweek the words he says, and the resistance will run with it, the way want them to.
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