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News & Current Events Discuss Trump ends shutdown, signs bill to reopen government at the General Forum; WASHINGTON Submitting to mounting pressure, President Donald Trump has signed a bill to reopen the government for three weeks, backing ...

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Old 01-26-2019, 01:38 AM
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Default Trump ends shutdown, signs bill to reopen government

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WASHINGTON
Submitting to mounting pressure, President Donald Trump has signed a bill to reopen the government for three weeks, backing down from his demand that Congress give him money for his border wall before federal agencies go back to work.

Standing alone in the Rose Garden Friday, Trump said he would sign legislation funding shuttered agencies until Feb. 15 and try again to persuade lawmakers to finance his long-sought wall. The deal he reached with congressional leaders contains no new money for the wall but ends the longest shutdown in U.S. history.

Read more here: https://www.myrtlebeachonline.com/ne...#storylink=cpy
Trump just caved in to the power of Nancy Pelosi and the Democrats. He's never going to get his wall and, while he continues to threaten America with another shutdown in three weeks, the Congress is never going to fund the Trump Wall.

During the next three weeks a joint House-Senate committee is going to focus on border security which is what the American people want. While some additional barriers such as fencing may result it's never going to equate to Trump's Wall.

For example the San Diego Border Patrol that already has over thirty miles of double fencing for pedestrians and vehicles wants some additional fencing but only five miles of additional fencing. More important to the San Diego Border Patrol are "more boots on the ground" and advanced electronic surveillance equipment to locate those attempting to enter the US where the wall doesn't exist.

The House-Senate joint committee is going to address real border security and there's never been any question about the fact that simply building a wall doesn't provide real border security. The American people will be informed on this as the House and Senate actually address border security and what's required.
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Old 01-26-2019, 04:30 AM
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Default Re: Trump ends shutdown, signs bill to reopen government

you know if any type of barrier is built or agreed upon trump will claim victory. and his followers will praise him and whatever barrier he gets in the deal.
at this point democrats could demand the moon — citzenship for dreamers; medicare for all — and trump would take it just to get something built on the southern border. sure, he’d get pushback from the conservative wing of the party but they typically get ignored anyway. and again trump would claim victory for showing compassion for dreamers and killing obamacare by getting medicare for all and his wall (though it would likely be a fence and smart technology) will be his trophy. and his followers would get in line and praise him for it.
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Old 01-26-2019, 07:57 AM
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Default Re: Trump ends shutdown, signs bill to reopen government

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Originally Posted by Gordon Shumway View Post
you know if any type of barrier is built or agreed upon trump will claim victory. and his followers will praise him and whatever barrier he gets in the deal.
at this point democrats could demand the moon — citzenship for dreamers; medicare for all — and trump would take it just to get something built on the southern border. sure, he’d get pushback from the conservative wing of the party but they typically get ignored anyway. and again trump would claim victory for showing compassion for dreamers and killing obamacare by getting medicare for all and his wall (though it would likely be a fence and smart technology) will be his trophy. and his followers would get in line and praise him for it.
Trump is driven by the Ann Coulter's and Rush Limbaugh's of the extreme right wing and while he could claim victory for an "electronic border" on the many miles of unfenced border they won't let him get away with it. They're his core and they're driven more by racial animus as opposed to concerns for national security. They refer to "refugees" that have a legal right to enter the United States as "hordes" of illegal immigrants while they're still a thousand miles from our border. They agree with Trump when he refers to Hispanic immigrants as an "infestation" of the United States. They want the Cotton-Purdue immigration "reform" that cuts non-white immigration in half because they hate non-whites.

The problem is that Trump doesn't care about the United States at all and has proven it time and time again. He only cares about Donald Trump and, as we've just seen with the shutdown, he's willing to throw Americans under the bus for the benefit of Donald Trump.

But he won't win in this case because Congress is going to actually address border security and not Trump's racist base.
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Old 01-26-2019, 08:27 AM
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Default Re: Trump ends shutdown, signs bill to reopen government

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Originally Posted by Gordon Shumway View Post
you know if any type of barrier is built or agreed upon trump will claim victory. and his followers will praise him and whatever barrier he gets in the deal.
at this point democrats could demand the moon ó citzenship for dreamers; medicare for all ó and trump would take it just to get something built on the southern border. sure, heíd get pushback from the conservative wing of the party but they typically get ignored anyway. and again trump would claim victory for showing compassion for dreamers and killing obamacare by getting medicare for all and his wall (though it would likely be a fence and smart technology) will be his trophy. and his followers would get in line and praise him for it.
Trump gave the Democrats what they said they wanted, reopen the government for a short period in return for negotiations to secure the border. They have demonstrated with luxury vacations and lobbyist junkets a callous disregard for the Federal workers and the public they serve. Now it's Nancy let them eat cake who has to come to the table instead of posturing.

The so-called smart technology that will not by coincidence line the pockets of Pelosi's Silicon valley cronies and can be switched off by the next Democrat touting open borders has problems of its own. Turns out Left wing groups object to the mass surveillance of the so-called smart technology on 4th amendment grounds.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.mer...over-idea/amp/

People who believe we ought to have a secure border like me weren't thrilled with Trump reopening the government without concessions from the imperial Democrats but in their irrational exuberance the Trump haters ignore his promise to invoke Presidential powers to build the wall if negotiations don't reach a satisfactory resolution. No doubt Resistance advocates have lawsuits drafted to present to carefully forum shopped Federal district judges so the kabuki court can issue a nationwide injunction but legal challenges were coming anyway, radical Leftist Democrats like AOC won't even vote to fund ICE.
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Old 01-26-2019, 10:03 AM
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Default Re: Trump ends shutdown, signs bill to reopen government

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Originally Posted by AZRWinger View Post
Trump gave the Democrats what they said they wanted, reopen the government for a short period in return for negotiations to secure the border. They have demonstrated with luxury vacations and lobbyist junkets a callous disregard for the Federal workers and the public they serve. Now it's Nancy let them eat cake who has to come to the table instead of posturing.

The so-called smart technology that will not by coincidence line the pockets of Pelosi's Silicon valley cronies and can be switched off by the next Democrat touting open borders has problems of its own. Turns out Left wing groups object to the mass surveillance of the so-called smart technology on 4th amendment grounds.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.mer...over-idea/amp/

People who believe we ought to have a secure border like me weren't thrilled with Trump reopening the government without concessions from the imperial Democrats but in their irrational exuberance the Trump haters ignore his promise to invoke Presidential powers to build the wall if negotiations don't reach a satisfactory resolution. No doubt Resistance advocates have lawsuits drafted to present to carefully forum shopped Federal district judges so the kabuki court can issue a nationwide injunction but legal challenges were coming anyway, radical Leftist Democrats like AOC won't even vote to fund ICE.
Or, in the real world, the shut down was an epic disaster for Trump and the Republicans, with poll after poll showing that a sizable majority donít believe that itís worth shutting the government down just for wall funding. Trumpís approval and Congressional GOP approval have tanked over the last month. The Democrats know that they have zero incentive to provide Trump with any wall funding. The ďmaster negotiatorĒ screwed the pooch completely with this fiasco. I continue to be amazed that anyone thought that a failed TV game show host and real estate huckster was remotely capable of being president.
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Old 01-26-2019, 12:18 PM
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Default Re: Trump ends shutdown, signs bill to reopen government

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Originally Posted by Constant_Slothrop View Post
Or, in the real world, the shut down was an epic disaster for Trump and the Republicans, with poll after poll showing that a sizable majority donít believe that itís worth shutting the government down just for wall funding. Trumpís approval and Congressional GOP approval have tanked over the last month. The Democrats know that they have zero incentive to provide Trump with any wall funding. The ďmaster negotiatorĒ screwed the pooch completely with this fiasco. I continue to be amazed that anyone thought that a failed TV game show host and real estate huckster was remotely capable of being president.
It's amusing to see the children of the Resistance Corn claim an exclusive franchise on reality as shown by unspecified polls.

Quote:
Gallup showed Trumpís job approval at 37 percent, down 2 points from his approval before Christmas.

Gallup found what you would expect ó virtually no change in Trumpís job ratings among Republicans and Democrats, but a measurable drop among independents.

Traditionally, independents are less engaged in politics, so their opinions tend to move around much more than partisans.

Economist/YouGov polling from late November 2018 to mid-January 2019 also showed little or no movement in the presidentís job ratings, ranging from 43-46 percent approval over that period of time.
https://www.rollcall.com/news/congre...rumps-standing

The President made it clear he will invoke a national emergency to build the wall. If Democrats continue to display the same lack of concern for the 800,000 Federal employees and border security as well as the DACA and TPS people they are going to get the worst of both worlds.
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Old 01-26-2019, 03:34 PM
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Default Re: Trump ends shutdown, signs bill to reopen government



Kinda looks that putins the only deal the so-called deal maker is capable of making.

<Inside Trumpís shutdown turnaround>


<His poll numbers were plummeting. His FBI director was decrying the dysfunction. The nationís air travel was in chaos. Federal workers were lining up at food banks. Economic growth was at risk of flatlining, and even some Republican senators were in open revolt.>

<So on Friday, the 35th day of a government shutdown that he said he was proud to instigate, President Trump finally folded. After vowing for weeks that he would keep the government closed unless he secured billions in funding for his promised border wall, Trump agreed to reopen it.>

<He got $0 instead.>

https://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...nl_most&wpmm=1
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Old 01-26-2019, 06:52 PM
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Default Re: Trump ends shutdown, signs bill to reopen government

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Originally Posted by AZRWinger View Post
Trump gave the Democrats what they said they wanted, reopen the government for a short period in return for negotiations to secure the border. They have demonstrated with luxury vacations and lobbyist junkets a callous disregard for the Federal workers and the public they serve. Now it's Nancy let them eat cake who has to come to the table instead of posturing.
The government shutdown began in December when the Republicans controlled both the Senate and the House. Speaker Paul Ryan owns the initial shutdown by refusing to allow a vote on the Republican controlled Senate's funding resolution that had unanimous bipartisan support.

The first act of the Democratically controlled House of Representatives was to pass a funding resolutions based upon the Republican controlled Senate's funding resolutions that had passed unanimously in December that also included short term funding for the DHS so that longer term funding for bipartisan border security resolution could be negotiated. Senate Majority Leader refused to allow a vote on the House funding resolutions because he knew there was enough bipartisan support to pass those resolution and reopen government.

The Democrats had done what was necessary to end the shutdown and there was nothing for the Democrats to negotiate so why not take a vacation while the ball was in the Republican's court when it came to ending the shutdown the Republicans were responsible for.

There's something else at play here that a presidential historian (sorry, I don't recall his name or credentials) pointed out this morning.

Donald Trump has never learned the difference between campaigning and governing. Trump was always in campaign mode since taking office pandering to his small percentage of American voters that were his core supporters.

With the 2018 election Trump has been pushed into territory he's unfamiliar with... actually having to govern.

Trump has not had a campaign rally in 62 days and hasn't played golf in 61 days because he's being forced to consider "governing" as opposed to "campaigning" while in the White House.

He made a small breakthrough when he gave directions to Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell to pass continuing resolutions to fund government without any funding for his Wall. When he did that his "base" represented by Ann Coulter and Rush Limbaugh exploded in his face and he had a relapse into his campaign mode. Immediately he rejected the very legislation that he'd told McConnell to pass in the Senate and demanded that the House reject that legislation and give him funding for the wall.

The shutdown was the result of Trump flip-flopping from "governing" to "campaigning" as President and it's been an unmitigated disaster for President Trump. Donald Trump had no idea about the functions and responsibilities under the authority of the President before he was elected and since being elected he's shown no interest in learning. Instead of being knowledgeable he stood before the American people and told them that the furloughed government employees supported the shutdown over the border wall. There's been a lot of demonstrations by federal workers that were affected on not a single one was in support of Trump's shutdown.

From inside the White House it was claimed that Trump, in referring to the shutdown, stated, "I'm being crushed" and "Why can't I get a deal?" Trump was being crushed because he had no knowledge about how devastating a government shutdown really is and he couldn't get a deal for two reasons.

First he never offered a deal to the Democrats. He called his proposal "bipartisan" but it offered nothing to the Democrats. A three-year suspension to the draconian Trump war against the Dreamers wasn't a deal. It was an insult. Trump could end the plight of those covered by DACA in less than a minute by reinstating the program he's trying to destroy. He doesn't need Democrats or Congressional approval for that. It's a problem he created and Democrats aren't going to reward him for creating that problem.

Next, and most important of all, no one including Republicans can trust Trump as far as they can spit. Trump had built his entire life around not being trustworthy by anyone. Why would anyone trust Trump for anything is a question searching for an answer.

But the presidential historian did offer a small glimmer of hope.

President Trump could choose to be presidential. Forget the campaign promise about a wall. It's not what the Border Patrol or the experts on border security want. Let the experts dictate what's needed. In some cases it will include more physical barriers (fencing) and we're aware of that. The San Diego Border patrol wants more physical barriers in addition to the 30 plus miles of double fencing they currently have. They're requesting five more miles of fencing but five miles is not what Donald Trump is demanding. They want electronic surveillance equipment to cover the mountains to the East that provide a natural barrier to illegal entry into the United States. They also want more Border Patrol agents because of an increase in illegal border crossing but that increase can be stopped without more agents.

Roughly 90,000 people have crossed the border in the San Diego area so that they could turn themselves in and apply for asylum. These are refugees that should have been granted asylum and allowed into the US when they showed up at the border crossings in the San Diego area. Why weren't they allowed to do that in compliance with the Refugee Act of 1980 and our immigration laws? We have Border Patrol agents that patrol the border doing what the Border Patrol agents at US ports of entry should be doing. Those 90,000 illegal crossings never needed to occur and the fact they did represents a waste of resources when it comes to criminal aliens illegally entering the United States. Trump could end the build-up of refugees in Mexica, that creates a humanitarian disaster, by simply ordering the Border Patrol to process the applications for asylum and allowing these refugees into the United States in compliance with our laws.

Trump could be Presidential by supporting legalization and a pathway to citizenship for those covered by DACA and by those that would be covered by DAPA.

Trump could be Presidential by promoting real immigration reform instead of the highly racist Cotton-Purdue legislation that his (white nationalist) political advisor Steve Miller (and former KKK Grand Wizard David Duke) support.

There's a lot of things Trump could do to be Presidential and actually govern the United States but many doubt he's capable of it. Trump has never been concerned about anyone but Donald Trump and for Trump to care about the United States and the American people just seems out of reach of a person that's always been a con man and criminal during his entire life.

Campaigning is something Trump can do but governing? Very unlikely.
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Based upon the corruption, brutality, inhumanity, immorality, dishonesty, and incompetence of the Trump administration the White House is the dirtiest house in America and there's no known cleanser that with remove the stains of the Trump Administration.

Last edited by ShivaTD; 01-26-2019 at 07:01 PM..
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Old 01-26-2019, 06:59 PM
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Default Re: Trump ends shutdown, signs bill to reopen government

Unfortunately, there are only two ways--neither especially likely, in my opinion--that the Trump administration may reasonably claim victory here:

(1) There is an agreement reached during the 21-day window, that includes wall funding--with at least 50 percent of the requested 5.7 billion dollars upfront.

(2) Failing that, President Trump shuts down the government again once 21 days have elapsed.

Frankly, I find #1 rather unlikely; and #2 even more unlikely, given the fact that far more people blamed President Trump than blamed the congressional Democrats for the government shutdown.

I do hope that I am mistaken.
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Old 01-26-2019, 07:13 PM
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Default Re: Trump ends shutdown, signs bill to reopen government

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Unfortunately, there are only two ways--neither especially likely, in my opinion--that the Trump administration may reasonably claim victory here:

(1) There is an agreement reached during the 21-day window, that includes wall funding--with at least 50 percent of the requested 5.7 billion dollars upfront.

(2) Failing that, President Trump shuts down the government again once 21 days have elapsed.

Frankly, I find #1 rather unlikely; and #2 even more unlikely, given the fact that far more people blamed President Trump than blamed the congressional Democrats for the government shutdown.

I do hope that I am mistaken.
#1 won't happen because it's not supported by any of the experts on border security including the Border Patrol that does want some additional barriers (fencing) but not very much of it and only in a few isolated locations. I've mentioned the San Diego Border Patrol want's five more miles of fencing that, according to the Army Corps of Engineers, would only cost $7.5 million dollars. Mostly San Diego wants more Border Patrol agents and electronic surveillance equipment to cover the mountains to the East that provide a barrier to illegal entry but that some still try to use to enter the United States.

It's been predicted that if Trump shuts down the government again or if he declares a bogus emergency to build the wall it will be the end of the Trump presidency. I'm not sure how it would end but either he'll be rendered incapable of doing anything by the House or he'll be impeached and removed from office for any of the numerous foundations for impeachment that already exist.

Trump's in a hard place and we should all pity him. Since taking offices he's never had to actually be the president. All he had to do was pretend he was the president. The Republican controlled Congress allowed Trump to play President but the Democrats aren't going to let him get away with it any more.
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Based upon the corruption, brutality, inhumanity, immorality, dishonesty, and incompetence of the Trump administration the White House is the dirtiest house in America and there's no known cleanser that with remove the stains of the Trump Administration.
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