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News & Current Events Discuss San Francisco Bay Area Experiences Mass Exodus Of Residents at the General Forum; Originally Posted by RedState San Francisco is expensive. Like, literally one of the most expensive places to live in the ...

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Old 02-11-2018, 10:56 AM
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Default Re: San Francisco Bay Area Experiences Mass Exodus Of Residents

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Originally Posted by RedState View Post
San Francisco is expensive. Like, literally one of the most expensive places to live in the country. People flock to San Francisco because of the high paying jobs in silicone valley. Which increases the cost of living. So what you are seeing is people leaving because they can't afford to pay rent or just live there. San Diego is slowly getting the same way.

Basically it's a bubble, and unless you make a **** load of money you can't afford to live there.

Why conservatives have such a hard on for California I'll never understand. Maybe it's because they have more fun and make more money there. And even with all those liberal policy's they still have a bigger economy than most traditional conservative red states combined.
I don't think that having 'fun and making more money' has anything to do with why any number of people have issues with California. How about a gateway for illegal immigration? Excessive (understatement) regulations and absurdly high taxes? Non-business friendly laws?

Making more money is pointless if your cost of living exceeds the benefits of the higher wage. I've been through that discussion a number of times with a sibling who lives in NJ. I could make twice what I make here in TN if I moved back to NJ - and my cost of living would triple.
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Old 02-11-2018, 11:13 AM
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Default Re: San Francisco Bay Area Experiences Mass Exodus Of Residents

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Originally Posted by Manitou View Post
This mass exodus and expensive living breaks my heart

WOHHHH-HAHAHAHA! Just kidding. Good for you, all you people who elected those politicians with the big heart for the south of the border freeloaders.





I feel it to... It was a GOP thingy our governor did.. Cost KS., plenty. "Trickle Down Economics"
Not that KS., isn't already over loaded with every fee or taxes, yet this went to dang far...
And after fighting for years, the KS., Supreme Court ruling adding more funds to our Public School correct funding Brownback leaves office saying Kansas, should find 400 million to follow the court demand to fiance public schools.
Our taxes rose as well as other sales taxes again.
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Old 02-12-2018, 12:30 AM
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Default Re: San Francisco Bay Area Experiences Mass Exodus Of Residents

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Originally Posted by GottaGo View Post
I don't think that having 'fun and making more money' has anything to do with why any number of people have issues with California. How about a gateway for illegal immigration? Excessive (understatement) regulations and absurdly high taxes? Non-business friendly laws?

Making more money is pointless if your cost of living exceeds the benefits of the higher wage. I've been through that discussion a number of times with a sibling who lives in NJ. I could make twice what I make here in TN if I moved back to NJ - and my cost of living would triple.
It was a joke. But I hear you. I don't think excessive immigration is as big of a problem as its made out to be. Most immigrants come here to work. And I beileve the stats show that the taxes they pay into the system outweigh any benefits they get.

However you might describe laws designed to protect workers, they don't seem to stop businesses from coming to California. Neither do the higher taxes. I will give that that there is luck involved, people want to live in fair weather places. But as the population grows so does the cost of government. Yes it's cheaper to live in Tennessee, but you won't find the amount of high paying jobs that California has to offer.

And that's the problem, yes California has great high paying jobs, even for low and unskilled workers, but the cost of living can be so high in places that it can negate those positives for a lot of people. However, I don't see much of a difference, sure Tennessee may cost less to live, but you will be making less and have less job opportunities. So in the end who is really better off?

But we are getting back to income inequality again. Rich get richer and permanent tax breaks, while everyone else gets the scraps left out.


We are on the same side beileve it or not. We just disagree on the small details. You mentioned New Jersey, you can't blame immigrants for the high cost of living there. And obviously if the laws were so anti business that they couldn't make a profit they wouldn't be paying twice as much as they do in tennessee. So what's the answer? I don't know. I'm not an economist, I just say what makes sense to me. So tell me where I'm wrong. But if we work togethor we could figure it out I'm sure. Like I said we are on the same side.
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Old 02-12-2018, 07:23 AM
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Default Re: San Francisco Bay Area Experiences Mass Exodus Of Residents

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Originally Posted by RedState View Post
It was a joke. But I hear you. I don't think excessive immigration is as big of a problem as its made out to be. Most immigrants come here to work. And I beileve the stats show that the taxes they pay into the system outweigh any benefits they get.

However you might describe laws designed to protect workers, they don't seem to stop businesses from coming to California. Neither do the higher taxes. I will give that that there is luck involved, people want to live in fair weather places. But as the population grows so does the cost of government. Yes it's cheaper to live in Tennessee, but you won't find the amount of high paying jobs that California has to offer.

And that's the problem, yes California has great high paying jobs, even for low and unskilled workers, but the cost of living can be so high in places that it can negate those positives for a lot of people. However, I don't see much of a difference, sure Tennessee may cost less to live, but you will be making less and have less job opportunities. So in the end who is really better off?

But we are getting back to income inequality again. Rich get richer and permanent tax breaks, while everyone else gets the scraps left out.

We are on the same side beileve it or not. We just disagree on the small details. You mentioned New Jersey, you can't blame immigrants for the high cost of living there. And obviously if the laws were so anti business that they couldn't make a profit they wouldn't be paying twice as much as they do in tennessee. So what's the answer? I don't know. I'm not an economist, I just say what makes sense to me. So tell me where I'm wrong. But if we work togethor we could figure it out I'm sure. Like I said we are on the same side.
There is no lack for job opportunities in Tennessee, don't know where you got that from.

While wages are not the equivalent of CA or NJ, the reduced cost of living more then compensates for it. Auto insurance, as an example. I have 3 vehicles on my policy, full coverage including comp & collision. I pay $1500 annually. In NJ, that would be around $5,000. No income tax in TN, but our sales tax is a bit higher (9.25%) then NJ (7%). Hopefully, you aren't spending as much as you make. Last I was there, NJ income tax was around 3% - now it's 5-8%. Real Estate taxes: I have 4 acres and a house, RE taxes of $1600. NJ, $15,000 for a lot less acreage. I could keep going.

For businesses, TN has the Halls tax of 6%, plus various fees and filing costs to maintain the entity. Since our entities are LLC-P's, the income tax flows through to the partners as individuals.

California individual tax rates range from 1%-12.3% plus a surcharge for those with income over $1M. Business tax rate is 8.84%.

That all being said, yeah, California in general has a nice climate, but taxes the dickens out of both people and businesses.
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Old 02-12-2018, 08:15 AM
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Default Re: San Francisco Bay Area Experiences Mass Exodus Of Residents

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Originally Posted by foundit66 View Post
Too many of the typical knee-jerk conservative responses with "liberals suck" as their obvious sole mental state.
People moving out of San Francisco? Yes.
Where do the majority of those people move to? Sacramento CALIFORNIA

People moving out of L.A? Yes.
Where do the majority of those people move to? San Diego CALIFORNIA


The article quoted "redfin" as their source and anybody who looked at it will recognize that.
https://www.redfin.com/blog/2017/11/...t-q3-2017.html

The site below shows California has had a POSITIVE net migration flow (more coming in than leaving) for the last several years.
State Migration Rates, Net Totals: 2011-2016
Overall the State of California is a net migration loser.

Quote:
And then there is the big enchilada, California. For generations, the Golden State developed a reputation as the ultimate destination of choice for millions of Americans. No longer. Since 2000 the state has lost 1.75 million net domestic migrants, according to Census Bureau estimates. And even amid an economic recovery, the pattern of outmigration continued in 2014, with a loss of 57,900 people and an attraction ratio of 88.5, placing the Golden State 13th from the bottom, well behind longtime people exporters Ohio, Indiana, Kentucky and Louisiana. California was a net loser of domestic migrants in all age categories.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.for...and-money/amp/

True, California isn't the worst in the nation but it's significant that despite its natural beauty radical Leftists have managed to make it unattractive.
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Old 02-12-2018, 08:39 AM
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Default Re: San Francisco Bay Area Experiences Mass Exodus Of Residents

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Originally Posted by RedState View Post
It was a joke. But I hear you. I don't think excessive immigration is as big of a problem as its made out to be. Most immigrants come here to work. And I beileve the stats show that the taxes they pay into the system outweigh any benefits they get.

However you might describe laws designed to protect workers, they don't seem to stop businesses from coming to California. Neither do the higher taxes. I will give that that there is luck involved, people want to live in fair weather places. But as the population grows so does the cost of government. Yes it's cheaper to live in Tennessee, but you won't find the amount of high paying jobs that California has to offer.

And that's the problem, yes California has great high paying jobs, even for low and unskilled workers, but the cost of living can be so high in places that it can negate those positives for a lot of people. However, I don't see much of a difference, sure Tennessee may cost less to live, but you will be making less and have less job opportunities. So in the end who is really better off?

But we are getting back to income inequality again. Rich get richer and permanent tax breaks, while everyone else gets the scraps left out.


We are on the same side beileve it or not. We just disagree on the small details. You mentioned New Jersey, you can't blame immigrants for the high cost of living there. And obviously if the laws were so anti business that they couldn't make a profit they wouldn't be paying twice as much as they do in tennessee. So what's the answer? I don't know. I'm not an economist, I just say what makes sense to me. So tell me where I'm wrong. But if we work togethor we could figure it out I'm sure. Like I said we are on the same side.
Instead of partisan rhetoric and speculation about wages and the cost of living, let's look at the data from the US Census bureau as reported by the Leftist LA Times.

Quote:
Guess which state has the highest poverty rate in the country? Not Mississippi, New Mexico, or West Virginia, but California, where nearly one out of five residents is poor. That's according to the Census Bureau's Supplemental Poverty Measure, which factors in the cost of housing, food, utilities and clothing, and which includes noncash government assistance as a form of income.
https://www.google.com/amp/www.latim...outputType=amp

Lower wages in other states haven't resulted in producing poverty as efficiently as the radical Leftists in California. If the objective is to create a fair economy, then having 1 out of 5 people living in poverty has to be considered a massive failure. Crude partisan rhetoric like income inequality cannot disguise the failure.
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Old 02-12-2018, 09:39 AM
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Default Re: San Francisco Bay Area Experiences Mass Exodus Of Residents

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Originally Posted by Manitou View Post
So there is no mass exodus from San Francisco?
I wonder if businesses are leaving. I hope so.
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Old 02-12-2018, 09:42 AM
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Default Re: San Francisco Bay Area Experiences Mass Exodus Of Residents

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Originally Posted by RedState View Post
San Francisco is expensive. Like, literally one of the most expensive places to live in the country. People flock to San Francisco because of the high paying jobs in silicone valley. Which increases the cost of living. So what you are seeing is people leaving because they can't afford to pay rent or just live there. San Diego is slowly getting the same way.

Basically it's a bubble, and unless you make a **** load of money you can't afford to live there.

Why conservatives have such a hard on for California I'll never understand. Maybe it's because they have more fun and make more money there. And even with all those liberal policy's they still have a bigger economy than most traditional conservative red states combined.
Maybe that's because it's a BIGGER state. Have you ever looked at a map?
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Old 02-12-2018, 02:55 PM
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Default Re: San Francisco Bay Area Experiences Mass Exodus Of Residents

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Originally Posted by Manitou View Post
So there is no mass exodus from San Francisco?
If you can't be bothered with reading comprehension, I won't bother with a reply...


Quote:
Originally Posted by RedState View Post
San Francisco is expensive. Like, literally one of the most expensive places to live in the country. People flock to San Francisco because of the high paying jobs in silicone valley. Which increases the cost of living. So what you are seeing is people leaving because they can't afford to pay rent or just live there. San Diego is slowly getting the same way.
Basically it's a bubble, and unless you make a **** load of money you can't afford to live there.
EXACTLY!!
It's about the economics of the situation, but too many on this thread want to tie their anti-liberal prejudices into the situation...


Quote:
Originally Posted by RedState View Post
Why conservatives have such a hard on for California I'll never understand. Maybe it's because they have more fun and make more money there. And even with all those liberal policy's they still have a bigger economy than most traditional conservative red states combined.
It's an obvious prejudice. Plain and simple.
The irrationality of the reaction along with the knee-jerk commentary?

As you noted, California does make more money. And thus it's a bigger target that they want to see fall...


Quote:
Originally Posted by American
Maybe that's because it's a BIGGER state. Have you ever looked at a map?
It's ranked #8 on a list of GDP per capita...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...GDP_per_capita

And for those trying to bash on blue state impact on the economy, looking at those top 10 only three are red states. The other seven are all blue states.

But why look at the facts when you can just knee-jerk b.s. comments, eh?
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Old 02-12-2018, 03:30 PM
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Default Re: San Francisco Bay Area Experiences Mass Exodus Of Residents

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Originally Posted by RedState View Post
It was a joke. But I hear you. I don't think excessive immigration is as big of a problem as its made out to be. Most immigrants come here to work. And I beileve the stats show that the taxes they pay into the system outweigh any benefits they get.

However you might describe laws designed to protect workers, they don't seem to stop businesses from coming to California. Neither do the higher taxes. I will give that that there is luck involved, people want to live in fair weather places. But as the population grows so does the cost of government. Yes it's cheaper to live in Tennessee, but you won't find the amount of high paying jobs that California has to offer.

And that's the problem, yes California has great high paying jobs, even for low and unskilled workers, but the cost of living can be so high in places that it can negate those positives for a lot of people. However, I don't see much of a difference, sure Tennessee may cost less to live, but you will be making less and have less job opportunities. So in the end who is really better off?

But we are getting back to income inequality again. Rich get richer and permanent tax breaks, while everyone else gets the scraps left out.


We are on the same side beileve it or not. We just disagree on the small details. You mentioned New Jersey, you can't blame immigrants for the high cost of living there. And obviously if the laws were so anti business that they couldn't make a profit they wouldn't be paying twice as much as they do in tennessee. So what's the answer? I don't know. I'm not an economist, I just say what makes sense to me. So tell me where I'm wrong. But if we work togethor we could figure it out I'm sure. Like I said we are on the same side.
Two questions, see bolded.

1.You mention that more people mean more government, that is true. But if those "more" people are working and paying taxes, why do they have to also raise the tax rate? Why don't the extra people paying taxes cover the extra expenses?

2. As people have said, the big money people are in silicon valley.
Why haven't these Uber rich (mostly democrats) offered to pay their fair
share? They elect high tax Liberals, why don't they offer to pay more?
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