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News & Current Events Discuss The NSA Is Building the Country’s Biggest Spy Center (Watch What You Say) at the General Forum; Well another white hat Government insider is blowing the whistle on what the NSA really does. the Bush Obama tag ...

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Old 04-22-2012, 11:26 PM
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Default The NSA Is Building the Country’s Biggest Spy Center (Watch What You Say)

Well another white hat Government insider is blowing the whistle on what the NSA really does. the Bush Obama tag team against the constitution continues... the constitution is on the ground lifeless, Obama's climbing onto the turnbuckles folks...

They collect everything and save it to look through later or now , just for grins. if this is homeland security trying to protect us what about the 4th amendment? "4th Amendment... we don't got no amendment.... we don't need no amendment, we don't need no STINKIN 4th amendment!!!


NSA: Orwellian Surveillance begins here
“…it was a direct violation of the constitutional rights of everybody in the country…”


From Democracy Now
Whistleblower: The NSA is Lying–U.S. Government Has Copies of Most of Your Emails

National Security Agency whistleblower William Binney reveals he believes domestic surveillance has become more expansive under President Obama than President George W. Bush. He estimates the NSA has assembled 20 trillion "transactions" — phone calls, emails and other forms of data — from Americans. This likely includes copies of almost all of the emails sent and received from most people living in the United States. Binney talks about Section 215 of the USA PATRIOT Act and challenges NSA Director Keith Alexander’s assertion that the NSA is not intercepting information about U.S. citizens.

from wired magazine
Quote:
"....
The former NSA official held his thumb and forefinger close together: “We are that far from a turnkey totalitarian state.”
Binney left the NSA in late 2001, shortly after the agency launched its warrantless-wiretapping program. “They violated the Constitution setting it up,” he says bluntly. “But they didn’t care. They were going to do it anyway, and they were going to crucify anyone who stood in the way. When they started violating the Constitution, I couldn’t stay.” Binney says Stellar Wind was far larger than has been publicly disclosed and included not just eavesdropping on domestic phone calls but the inspection of domestic email. ...


After he left the NSA, Binney suggested a system for monitoring people’s communications according to how closely they are connected to an initial target. The further away from the target—say you’re just an acquaintance of a friend of the target—the less the surveillance. But the agency rejected the idea, and, given the massive new storage facility in Utah, Binney suspects that it now simply collects everything. “The whole idea was, how do you manage 20 terabytes of intercept a minute?” he says. “The way we proposed was to distinguish between things you want and things you don’t want.” Instead, he adds, “they’re storing everything they gather.” And the agency is gathering as much as it can.
Once the communications are intercepted and stored, the data-mining begins. “You can watch everybody all the time with data- mining,” Binney says. Everything a person does becomes charted on a graph, “financial transactions or travel or anything,” he says. Thus, as data like bookstore receipts, bank statements, and commuter toll records flow in, the NSA is able to paint a more and more detailed picture of someone’s life.
The NSA also has the ability to eavesdrop on phone calls directly and in real time. According to Adrienne J. Kinne, who worked both before and after 9/11 as a voice interceptor at the NSA facility in Georgia, in the wake of the World Trade Center attacks “basically all rules were thrown out the window, and they would use any excuse to justify a waiver to spy on Americans.” Even journalists calling home from overseas were included. “A lot of time you could tell they were calling their families,” she says, “incredibly intimate, personal conversations.” Kinne found the act of eavesdropping on innocent fellow citizens personally distressing. “It’s almost like going through and finding somebody’s diary,” she says...."
The NSA Is Building the Country's Biggest Spy Center (Watch What You Say) | Threat Level | Wired.com

Exclusive: National Security Agency Whistleblower William Binney on Growing State Surveillance

Video of democracy now interview
Exclusive: National Security Agency Whistleblower William Binney on Growing State Surveillance


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Old 04-22-2012, 11:33 PM
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Default re: The NSA Is Building the Country’s Biggest Spy Center (Watch What You Say)

One Ring to Rule Them All: The Total Information Awareness Ring Is Being Forged

Quote:
This video is a DemocracyNow interview with NSA whistleblower William Binney who resigned from a thirty year career at the agency in 2001 due to the extreme illegality of the post 9/11 decisions to disregard any Constitutional protections of American citizens.
So we have an Anti-Patriot Act Hyperventalist who retired ELEVEN YEARS AGO telling us what he "BELIEVES" is happening now and it's supposed to be taken seriously?...
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Old 04-22-2012, 11:46 PM
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Default re: The NSA Is Building the Country’s Biggest Spy Center (Watch What You Say)

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Originally Posted by cnredd View Post
One Ring to Rule Them All: The Total Information Awareness Ring Is Being Forged

So we have an Anti-Patriot Act Hyperventalist who retired ELEVEN YEARS AGO telling us what he "BELIEVES" is happening now and it's supposed to be taken seriously?...
So someone who helped create the system and went to congressional oversite boards to tell them that what the adminstrations were and are doing was unconstitutional should not be taken seriously?

someone whose worked inside for 30 years?
someone who quit over the unconstitutional crap he witnessed 1st hand?
someone who says in the article and interview that he stays in contact with others he's work with for years who still work there.

uh yeah, i think so.

but hey if you think it's wise to dismiss this guy out of hand because you love your government and theys never dos no wrong, don't let me get in you way.

WONDER
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Old 04-23-2012, 03:24 AM
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Default re: The NSA Is Building the Country’s Biggest Spy Center (Watch What You Say)

This been happening for at least the last 20 to 30 years. They originate the spying in foreign countries so that they technically aren't breaking the law.

Just like when we do our torture in third world hells.

Oh and nobody cares Mr. Wonder. Theyd rather talk about the latest bs/scare/scandal on fox or cnn or whatever pick your posion.

Modern media are the real terrorists in this country. Spreading hate and fear and consumerism 24/7.
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Old 04-23-2012, 07:21 AM
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Default re: The NSA Is Building the Country’s Biggest Spy Center (Watch What You Say)

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This been happening for at least the last 20 to 30 years. They originate the spying in foreign countries so that they technically aren't breaking the law.

Just like when we do our torture in third world hells.

Oh and nobody cares Mr. Wonder. Theyd rather talk about the latest bs/scare/scandal on fox or cnn or whatever pick your posion.

Modern media are the real terrorists in this country. Spreading hate and fear and consumerism 24/7.
sadly you may be right. my wife is just now starting to pay attention to stuff like this and is going to pull some of her info off of Facebook. (it's a start)

I guess the only thing I'd edit of your statement is that 20 or 30 years ago the federales had to work a lot harder to get all of the info they can get now on everyone from the pipes of the interwebs, or through the air with cell phones.

they would mostly have to get warrents for all of that. Nowadays they just get it themselves or the federales send a secret threatening note to a phone company, ISP, bank, store or library.
like Good old Writs of Assistance, one of the things that started the revolution,

but it does seem to many people nowadays love the kings and the bread and circuses.
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Old 04-23-2012, 11:07 AM
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Default re: The NSA Is Building the Country’s Biggest Spy Center (Watch What You Say)

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Originally Posted by mr. wonder View Post
sadly you may be right. my wife is just now starting to pay attention to stuff like this and is going to pull some of her info off of Facebook. (it's a start)

I guess the only thing I'd edit of your statement is that 20 or 30 years ago the federales had to work a lot harder to get all of the info they can get now on everyone from the pipes of the interwebs, or through the air with cell phones.

they would mostly have to get warrents for all of that. Nowadays they just get it themselves or the federales send a secret threatening note to a phone company, ISP, bank, store or library.
like Good old Writs of Assistance, one of the things that started the revolution,

but it does seem to many people nowadays love the kings and the bread and circuses.
You ever heard of echelon? the ability to intercept phone and fax and any other type of transmission has been around since the 1960's.
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Old 04-23-2012, 11:10 AM
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Default re: The NSA Is Building the Country’s Biggest Spy Center (Watch What You Say)

The NSA-FBI-CIA and "others" have been using electronic surveillance for decades! As the tactics and technological abilities of our enemies grow,many believe we must be increasingly vigilant. Our freedoms simply do not exist in a vacuum and vast oceans no longer protect us. The situation is what it is,there's no turning back without accepting great risk to our way of life and the loss of our sovereignty.

I have no doubt that electronic surveillance can be abused,often other information is obtained in the process that can be used as a political weapon against a domestic political candidate. Or the powers that be can use this "bonus" information to impose pressure on opponents both foreign and domestic. Do I like it?..not much.. but I also know that turning back the hands of time and ignoring the fact that our enemies will take every possible advantage of today's technological weapons and use them against us is dangerous.

Even if the Constitution and our rights were upheld 100% on the surface and everyone came to "believe" that they were "secure" and protected from illegal surveillance,it would be nothing more than a placebo and false feeling of privacy.

Last edited by Spencer Collins; 04-23-2012 at 11:35 AM..
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Old 04-23-2012, 12:06 PM
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Post Re: The NSA Is Building the Country’s Biggest Spy Center (Watch What You Say)

[moderator mode]
Changed thread title to match wired article title.
[/moderator mode]
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Old 04-23-2012, 12:18 PM
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Default Re: The NSA Is Building the Country’s Biggest Spy Center (Watch What You Say)

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Originally Posted by Spencer Collins View Post
The NSA-FBI-CIA and "others" have been using electronic surveillance for decades! As the tactics and technological abilities of our enemies grow,many believe we must be increasingly vigilant. Our freedoms simply do not exist in a vacuum and vast oceans no longer protect us. The situation is what it is,there's no turning back without accepting great risk to our way of life and the loss of our sovereignty.

I have no doubt that electronic surveillance can be abused,often other information is obtained in the process that can be used as a political weapon against a domestic political candidate. Or the powers that be can use this "bonus" information to impose pressure on opponents both foreign and domestic. Do I like it?..not much.. but I also know that turning back the hands of time and ignoring the fact that our enemies will take every possible advantage of today's technological weapons and use them against us is dangerous.

Even if the Constitution and our rights were upheld 100% on the surface and everyone came to "believe" that they were "secure" and protected from illegal surveillance,it would be nothing more than a placebo and false feeling of privacy.
all due respect Spencer but that's BS,
foreigners aren't trying to spy on me but my own government. I'm not a lick safer because the NSA reads our e-mail or records our phone WITHOUT a WARRANT. There's ZERO safety added by that ,only more danger from an oppressive state that has more regulations on the books than can ever be obeyed and more people in prison than any country in the world.
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Old 04-23-2012, 01:09 PM
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Default Re: The NSA Is Building the Country’s Biggest Spy Center (Watch What You Say)

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Originally Posted by mr. wonder View Post
all due respect Spencer but that's BS,
foreigners aren't trying to spy on me but my own government. I'm not a lick safer because the NSA reads our e-mail or records our phone WITHOUT a WARRANT. There's ZERO safety added by that ,only more danger from an oppressive state that has more regulations on the books than can ever be obeyed and more people in prison than any country in the world.
And if they told you that this spying has now officially ended would you believe them and feel that your privacy is now secure? This spying will continue regardless of what administration is in power and assurances that your privacy is assured.

Welcome to the jungle..
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