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Old 11-27-2017, 09:38 PM
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Default MSNBC host Joy Reidís comments about rural America are stunning in their arrogance, i

That's right - rural America is the core threat to our democracy.

Obvious racist tones. Joy doesn't mention the drugs and violence among African Americans in the populated and inner-cities. No, it's those white crackers livin' out in the country.

What kind of super-crack was MSNBC smokin' when they decided it was a good idea to hire this tard?

Can you imagine the screams of "racism" if a white dude on Fox News said the inner-cities were the core threat to democracy?

Quote:
For the last several years, Democrats have been complaining about the constitution. While they lament Donald Trump's supposed disregard for the constitutional processes in the United States, they have been trying to delegitimize the fifty states as semi-sovereign powers in our federal system.

Democrats do not like that states are not just administrative subdivisions of Washington and they hate that the Senate has legitimacy.

In fact, Joy Reid of MSNBC is on social media calling rural Americans a "core threat" to our democracy. Note the following tweets below:

Both Kyle Griffin's original tweet and Reid's response highlight a core threat to our constitutional system: basic ignorance. The several states formed the national government, ceding certain powers outlined in Section 8 of the first article of the constitution. They kept the rest of the powers for themselves. This is and has always been our basic constitutional system. We are a republic with representative democracy components in its operation.

Tragically, in a fit of progressivism in the early part of the 20th century, the constitution was amended to allow for the direct election of senators instead of by appointment through state legislative processes. This allowed the federal government to become even more important. The ultimate solution for campaign finance reform is to actually repeal the 17th amendment and force the left and right to fight at the state level.

Notwithstanding that, to have a national "news" host call rural America a "core threat" to our democracy is both striking arrogance and striking ignorance. Also, as with gun rights, it would require a dramatic constitutional overhaul.
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Old 11-27-2017, 10:14 PM
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Post Re: MSNBC host Joy Reidís comments about rural America are stunning in their arroganc

HJ?
You race-bait so much it ain't even funny...


Joy said absolutely nothing about race, but YOU gotta drag race into this dontcha...
Cuz she's black.

Regarding what she actually said, if you would drop your hyperbolic freak-out session you would see that her comments are more directly referencing a simple population shift which is moving our Senate representation further away from a "democratic" representation.

Joy referenced the below tweet.
https://twitter.com/kylegriffin1/sta...68634990628865
By 2040, about 70% of Americans are expected to live in the 15 largest states. They will have only 30 senators representing them, while the remaining 30% of Americans will have 70 senators representing them.
Note: ABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO DO with race in this assessment...
And looking at it completely factually, it's a clearly documented way in which our government representation will be more skewed away from a democracy.
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Old 11-28-2017, 03:50 AM
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Default Re: MSNBC host Joy Reidís comments about rural America are stunning in their arroganc

Quote:
Originally Posted by foundit66 View Post
Joy referenced the below tweet.
https://twitter.com/kylegriffin1/sta...68634990628865
By 2040, about 70% of Americans are expected to live in the 15 largest states. They will have only 30 senators representing them, while the remaining 30% of Americans will have 70 senators representing them.
Note: ABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO DO with race in this assessment...
And looking at it completely factually, it's a clearly documented way in which our government representation will be more skewed away from a democracy.
It's skewed toward a REPUBLIC....where the states have equal say...

Now compare that the House, where 70% of the representation DOES come from the larger states...THAT's where it's skewed towards a Democracy...

Get it?...

Democratic Republic?....Ring a bell?...
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Old 11-28-2017, 10:43 AM
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Post Re: MSNBC host Joy Reidís comments about rural America are stunning in their arroganc

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Originally Posted by cnredd View Post
It's skewed toward a REPUBLIC....where the states have equal say...
Now compare that the House, where 70% of the representation DOES come from the larger states...THAT's where it's skewed towards a Democracy...
Get it?...
Democratic Republic?....Ring a bell?...
That's understood.
And you'll note that Joy and I specified just the Senate.

I can't help but wonder why you pointed that out (when nobody needed it being pointed out) and completely ignored HJ's race-baiting...
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Old 11-28-2017, 11:28 AM
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Default Re: MSNBC host Joy Reidís comments about rural America are stunning in their arroganc

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Originally Posted by foundit66 View Post
That's understood.
And you'll note that Joy and I specified just the Senate.
But "just" specifying the Senate" only tells half the story...Joy said that it's the core threat to our democracy, and it's NOT when you include the lie of omission, which is the House...

It's like saying any president is a dictator because they can appoint anyone they want to be the Secretary of Defense....Pure bullsh*t lie of omission...


Quote:
Originally Posted by foundit66
I can't help but wonder why you pointed that out (when nobody needed it being pointed out) and completely ignored HJ's race-baiting...
Because I see nothing arguable...

You may conclude it's not racist, but "rural" and "urban" have been used as "black" and "white"...

Quote:
Urban means relating to or concerned with a city or densely populated area, The term is exploited by corporations such as MTV to refer to black music/culture, without mentioning race.
WHAT DO YOU MEAN WHEN YOU SAY URBAN?

Quote:
Across the river in North Portland, there is a high school named Jefferson. It is surrounded by family dwellings, mom-and-pop shops, and wide streets for biking, walking, and playing. There is a community college across the street.

Which one of these schools is urban? Lincoln? Jefferson? Both?

Before you decide, let me give you a bit more information. At Lincoln, the downtown school, the population is more than 75 percent white, 4.5 percent of the students are black, 8.6 percent are Asian, and 6.6 percent are Latina/o; 10.5 percent are on free/reduced lunch; and the school does not receive Title 1 funding. At Jefferson, the school across the river, 59 percent of the students are black, 8 percent are Asian/Pacific Islanders, and 17 percent are Latina/o; 70 percent are on free/reduced lunch; and the school does receive Title 1 funding.

Made up your mind yet?

A few years ago I interviewed 17 teachers who attended an urban education program. I asked them what was the difference, if any, between urban teaching and non-urban teaching. Ruth remarked: To me, urban students come from an environment where they cant see the value of education. They cant see why it matters, because everyone that they know, everything that they do, has nothing to do with having an education.

Thinking about the definition of urbanrelated to the cityI cant help but wonder: What is it about city kids that makes this teacher think they dont value education? It wasnt until after three interviews of each teacher that the whole picture emerged, one in which urban was constructed as a code word for racespecifically black and Latina/oand often for poor. Teachers equated urban with students of color and the characteristics they perceived as belonging to students of color.
What Does "Urban" Mean?

Quote:
I'm not talking about the dictionary definition: an adjective meaning "of the city," derived from Latin urbanus and ultimately urbs, "city." Because that doesn't explain what "urban" is doing in this phrase, reproduced verbatim from a report I heard recently on my local public-radio station:

Like most urban cities, Oakland...

Like most city-ish cities?

No, of course not. "Urban cities" may seem redundant, but the reporter had something else in mind. Increasingly over the last few decades, "urban" has acquired a secondary meaning: "dominated by a racial minority, usually African-American."
Considering Joy Reid's history of seeing the world through skin color, it really does sound like this is exactly what she's getting at...
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Old 11-29-2017, 10:58 AM
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Post Re: MSNBC host Joy Reidís comments about rural America are stunning in their arroganc

Quote:
Originally Posted by cnredd View Post
But "just" specifying the Senate" only tells half the story...Joy said that it's the core threat to our democracy, and it's NOT when you include the lie of omission, which is the House...
It's like saying any president is a dictator because they can appoint anyone they want to be the Secretary of Defense....Pure bullsh*t lie of omission...

You talk about "lie of omission".
Hold onto that pretty thought because I'm going to use your standard here for what you just did...


Quote:
Originally Posted by cnredd View Post
Because I see nothing arguable...
You may conclude it's not racist, but "rural" and "urban" have been used as "black" and "white"...
WHAT DO YOU MEAN WHEN YOU SAY URBAN?
What Does "Urban" Mean?
Considering Joy Reid's history of seeing the world through skin color, it really does sound like this is exactly what she's getting at...
You say "urban" but that is not specifically what she said here.
This is the core threat to our democracy. The rural minority -- the people @JYSexton just wrote a long thread about -- have and will continue to have disproportionate power over the urban majority. https://t.co/fzBHaZ9kzR
— Joy Reid (@JoyAnnReid) November 26, 2017
Funny how you left off the "majority" and "minority" from those discussions.
Would that be YOUR "lie of omission"? It seems, using your standard, that one could say that, right?

Because those words are where your response falls apart.
First off, as I pointed out the original tweet she was talking about said nothing about this.

Secondly, those words "majority" and "minority" completely destroy your analysis.

To point out the obvious, BLACKS are the minority in this country. Only 13.3% of this country are black.

So to assume a reference to "urban" means "black" would be to falsely assume this is talking about a black majority, which I would hope we would both agree that Joy shows no rational evidence of confusing.
That is your analysis which cuts out half of the phrases to fixate on two words...

Same for "rural". Her phrase was "rural minority". So do you really think she was saying "white minority"???


This thread is another example of right-wing race-baiting.
And your claims of "lie of omission" on my part are b.s. I seriously didn't think people were failing to comprehend the situation so badly (other than HJ).
However, a stronger argument can be made for why you fixated on the word "urban" while ignoring the fact that the phrase was actually urban majority. And the only way that works is when people recognize that she was not using "urban" as a substitute for black.
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Old 11-29-2017, 11:26 AM
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Default Re: MSNBC host Joy Reidís comments about rural America are stunning in their arroganc

Quote:
Originally Posted by foundit66 View Post

You talk about "lie of omission".
Hold onto that pretty thought because I'm going to use your standard here for what you just did...



You say "urban" but that is not specifically what she said here.
This is the core threat to our democracy. The rural minority -- the people @JYSexton just wrote a long thread about -- have and will continue to have disproportionate power over the urban majority. https://t.co/fzBHaZ9kzR
ó Joy Reid (@JoyAnnReid) November 26, 2017
Funny how you left off the "majority" and "minority" from those discussions.
Would that be YOUR "lie of omission"? It seems, using your standard, that one could say that, right?

Because those words are where your response falls apart.
First off, as I pointed out the original tweet she was talking about said nothing about this.

Secondly, those words "majority" and "minority" completely destroy your analysis.

To point out the obvious, BLACKS are the minority in this country. Only 13.3% of this country are black.

So to assume a reference to "urban" means "black" would be to falsely assume this is talking about a black majority, which I would hope we would both agree that Joy shows no rational evidence of confusing.
That is your analysis which cuts out half of the phrases to fixate on two words...

Same for "rural". Her phrase was "rural minority". So do you really think she was saying "white minority"???


This thread is another example of right-wing race-baiting.
And your claims of "lie of omission" on my part are b.s. I seriously didn't think people were failing to comprehend the situation so badly (other than HJ).
However, a stronger argument can be made for why you fixated on the word "urban" while ignoring the fact that the phrase was actually urban majority. And the only way that works is when people recognize that she was not using "urban" as a substitute for black.
I see your nitpick and will rebut...

Read the definitions from my last post again...

Quote:
It wasnt until after three interviews of each teacher that the whole picture emerged, one in which urban was constructed as a code word for racespecifically black and Latina/oand often for poor. Teachers equated urban with students of color and the characteristics they perceived as belonging to students of color.

...No, of course not. "Urban cities" may seem redundant, but the reporter had something else in mind. Increasingly over the last few decades, "urban" has acquired a secondary meaning: "dominated by a racial minority, usually African-American."
You're attempting to write my point that "urban"="black" as "urban"="black AND NOTHING ELSE"...

That is false...

As these two examples show, it can ALSO be used "often for poor" and "the characteristics they perceived as belonging to students of color" (which includes a ton of white people)...

It also includes areas "dominated by a racial minority, usually African-American."...

So there is no concrete definition...and you're trying to use the most narrow to push your point...But there is no doubt that using "urban" DOES, as HJ said, have "Obvious racist tones"...

Second, HJ's question (Can you imagine the screams of "racism" if a white dude on Fox News said the inner-cities were the core threat to democracy?) is accurate...That would be interpreted as "black" from every mainstream reporter and pundit worth their weigh Leftwing agendas...
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Old 11-29-2017, 03:36 PM
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Post Re: MSNBC host Joy Reidís comments about rural America are stunning in their arroganc

Quote:
Originally Posted by cnredd View Post
I see your nitpick and will rebut...

NOT nitpick.

There were two phrases used.
urban majority
rural minority

The actual phrases themselves repudiate your claimed interpretation.
It's hilarious how you start out with this "lie of omission" crap, but when I show what you omitted suddenly it's "nitpicking"...


Quote:
Originally Posted by cnredd View Post
Read the definitions from my last post again...
You're attempting to write my point that "urban"="black" as "urban"="black AND NOTHING ELSE"...
That is false...

No.

I am saying there is no evidence Joy meant "black".
You responded by pointing out urban can mean black.
I pointed out can mean is obviously NOT the actual intended meaning in this example when one considers the WHOLE PHRASE which you "lie of omissioned" around...


Quote:
Originally Posted by cnredd View Post
As these two examples show, it can ALSO be used "often for poor" and "the characteristics they perceived as belonging to students of color" (which includes a ton of white people)...
It also includes areas "dominated by a racial minority, usually African-American."...
The problem is urban was the adjective. NOT THE NOUN.
The phrase was URBAN MAJORITY.
The fact that the phrase was "URBAN MAJORITY[/b] helps eliminate any pretense that the phrase was about blacks, who are the minority.

The overall context was clear in what Joy was referencing:
"By 2040, about 70% of Americans are expected to live in the 15 largest states. They will have only 30 senators representing them, while the remaining 30% of Americans will have 70 senators representing them."

So no. This is not about race.
Quit trying to make it about race when the context clearly shows it is not about race.


Quote:
Originally Posted by cnredd View Post
So there is no concrete definition...and you're trying to use the most narrow to push your point...But there is no doubt that using "urban" DOES, as HJ said, have "Obvious racist tones"...

Quit moving the goal-posts. Quit trying to exacerbate lying by omission.
HJ AND YOU did NOT SAY "urban has potential definitions for race". If that had been the statement, I would have agreed.

What HJ did and you tried to defend is claim Joy was talking about race, when she clearly wasn't.

Words obviously have multiple potential definitions.
Which definition is intended is established by looking at the context.
The lie of omission (your phrase, remember) was to STRIP THE CONTEXT away by ignoring:
1) The quote that Joy was talking about, and
2) The phrases involve explicitly eliminate any pretense that "race" is what is being described.


Quote:
Originally Posted by cnredd View Post
Second, HJ's question (Can you imagine the screams of "racism" if a white dude on Fox News said the inner-cities were the core threat to democracy?) is accurate...That would be interpreted as "black" from every mainstream reporter and pundit worth their weigh Leftwing agendas...
It's funny how you perpetrate YOUR SIDE of this lie of omission, but then you try to defend your guilt by fantasizing about what would have happened on some nonsensical Fox News scenario.
For the parallel to make any sense (and actually keep the whole phrases), it would have to involve a migration of people from urban areas to rural areas.
Which would actually be a transition TO a more democratic representation for the Senate
Ergo, the reply makes absolutely no sense other than to try to excuse race-baiting by imagining others would do it in an alternative, undefined, nonsensical counter-hypothetical...


You want to know the really stupid part of this discussion cnredd?
NOWHERE DID FOX NEWS claim she made any "racial" overtones.
Here's the article which HJ neglected to link to.
http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2017/...ignorance.html
NOWHERE did they say that.
That's something HJ invented out of thin air and you doubled down on...

Fox News focused on the phrase "core threat".
And the funny thing is that I agree that was poor phrasing on her part.
I would be fascinated to know if the founding fathers had any kind of appreciation for such a skewed situation. I don't think they had any idea that it would shift to something like that...

But instead of acknowledging the reality of the situation, we are instead dumbing down the conversation because HJ wants to race-bait and you want to defend him...
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Last edited by foundit66; 11-29-2017 at 11:48 PM..
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