Ridiculous Fox News Claim of the Day: Reason Caused the Holocaust
 

National Day of Reason backlash: Penny Nance blames the Holocaust on reason on Fox news.
Video at the site.

So "reason" was part of the reason for the Holocaust?
:eek

The stupidity of it all is mind-boggling.

Re: Ridiculous Fox News Claim of the Day: Reason Caused the Holocaust
 

WOW! Fox news again. OMG they took our day away:eek Concerned Woman for America. Yicks!:rolls

Re: Ridiculous Fox News Claim of the Day: Reason Caused the Holocaust
 

Bring back the dark ages NOW! :rofl

Re: Ridiculous Fox News Claim of the Day: Reason Caused the Holocaust
 

If anyone from the Left actually READ the comment instead of hearing something-something-about Fox News and breaking a blood vessel, you'll find she didn't say what the title is at all...

Didn't anyone see the words "gave way"???????...:yes

That means "took a back seat"...:yes

In other words, she was saying that if the "Age of Enlightenment and Reason" stuck around longer and moral relativism didn't rear its disgusting, ugly head to overtake it, the Holocaust would've never happened...

She's saying the LACK of reason caused the Holocaust...

Take it from Slate to not only get it wrong, but be actually wrong a full 180 degrees...:rolls

Re: Ridiculous Fox News Claim of the Day: Reason Caused the Holocaust
 

I watched. I watched the FOX news guy slow pitch it to this putz,

Re: Ridiculous Fox News Claim of the Day: Reason Caused the Holocaust
 

You should have listened, that's your problem.

Re: Ridiculous Fox News Claim of the Day: Reason Caused the Holocaust
 

Moral relativism encompasses views and arguments that people in various cultures have held over several thousand years. For example, the ancient Jaina Anekantavada principle of Mahavira (c. 599 – 527 BC) states that truth and reality are perceived differently from diverse points of view, and that no single point of view is the complete truth;[5][6] and the Greek philosopher Protagoras (c. 481 – 420 BC) famously asserted that "man is the measure of all things". The Greek historian Herodotus (c. 484 – 420 BC) observed that each society regards its own belief system and way of doing things as better than all others. Various other ancient philosophers also questioned the idea of an objective standard of morality.

anthropologists in the late forties promoted moral relativism when dealing with other cultures...that is where our modern lack of values comes from according to historians.


furthermore moral relativism is not all decadence.
Stanford encyclopedia of philosophy states:

Re: Ridiculous Fox News Claim of the Day: Reason Caused the Holocaust
 

Listen to what? Faux outrage?

Re: Ridiculous Fox News Claim of the Day: Reason Caused the Holocaust
 

Actually, this thread was started as outrage TOWARDS Fox...:yes

Read it again...:sigh

"gave way"...

That means the FALL of the Age of Enlightenment and Reason...

That means the ASCENT of moral relativism...

Moral relativism TOOK OVER for enlightenment and reason, so moral relativism is the cause for the Holocaust...NOT the enlightenment or reason...:yes

Now whether you agree with that or not is irrelevant to this thread...

The article has it 180 degrees wrong and says this Nance lady said that reason was the cause, when, in fact, she was saying the DEATH of reason was the cause...:yes :(

Side note - Funny how someone brings up a Conservative blog site and you go ballistic, but Liberal blog site Slate?...Jump right on board blindly!...:rolls

Re: Ridiculous Fox News Claim of the Day: Reason Caused the Holocaust
 

2 problems. First the article title is a lie. Fox never said "reason Caused the Holocaust." Penny Nance, CEO of Concerned Women for America, was the one making the statement. Nance sayin' something and then others saying Fox News made the statement is bush league and pure desperation. Must be a slow news day if we're playing this stupid game. For cryin' out loud stop lying.

Now let's look at the 2nd lie which is the fact Nance didn't even say "reason Caused the Holocaust." She said the Age of Enlightenment and Reason gave way to moral relativism and moral relativism is what she feels led us all the way down the dark path to the Holocaust.

"You know the Age of Enlightenment and Reason gave way to moral relativism. And moral relativism is what led us all the way down the dark path to the Holocaust."

So not only does the article lie by saying Fox News made this claim but they take it a step further and lie about the quote itself. Piss poor journalism and a bad attempt to fool people. Next time just be honest. But hey the truth is not as sensational and won't draw as many people to the story or thread. If a truthful title was there like "CWA CEO says relativism led us down path to the Holocaust" then great. Nothing news worthy there but if you swap out "CWA CEO" for "Fox News" and then change "And moral relativism is what led us all the way down the dark path to the Holocaust" to "Reason caused the Holocaust" you got a story. A lying, heaping, pile of **** story but hey it's Slate and they can't be too picky or concerned about the truth.

To lie about the quote and then lie about who said it is shameful. I wouldn't have posted this piece of crap knowing it had 2 lies in it right out of the gate. My guess is foundit69 saw the title had "Fox" and a Holocaust reference in it, became giddy as a kid, and ran to his computer to post it. If he'd read it he woulda knew the quote was wrong and not even stated by the one they're claiming it was.

Article Journalistic Rating

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Re: Ridiculous Fox News Claim of the Day: Reason Caused the Holocaust
 

You're taking it WAYYY too literal.
Quite frankly, I watched the video and recognized that the stupid claim was found ON Fox News, but obviously not by Fox News.

Fox News doesn't make all the stupid statements on their show. That's true.
But they DO choose who to interview. They DO choose how to respond to those stupid statements.
While not as culpable as if they had said it themselves (which is a very literal interpretation of the subject line :rolls ), they are culpable when they repeatedly engage with people who say profoundly stupid things.

:rolls
First of all, she's stupid for thinking "moral relativism" had anything to do with the holocaust in the first place. The corrupted Christian dogma (much like how Muslim dogma is corrupted to yield jihad) lead to the Holocaust.
Hitler's Christianity

Anybody who listens to the video can easily recognize that she was out to attack "reason".
One has to wonder why the heck she would even bring up the holocaust since "moral relativism" was NOT the topic at hand.
"Reason" was.

Her comment on Reason "gave way" is obviously an indication that she believes reason LEAD TO moral relativism.
Rational news organizations should not have given this nutjob a pulpit in the first place. :rolls

Re: Ridiculous Fox News Claim of the Day: Reason Caused the Holocaust
 

Nope just busting up the lying thread title. Says Fox made a claim. They didn't. Nance made the claim. That's what we call a lie. If CNN has some wacko on and they claim man didn't land on the moon that doesn't mean CNN made that claim.

Not the point. Point is she never said reason led us to the Holocaust which is obvious to anyone who knows how to read or capable of comprehending the English language. For the slower students in the class I'll quote her again.

If you're still confused let me help you out further. Nance, not Fox News, said the Age of Enlightenment and reason gave way to relativism. And moral relativism led us to the path of the Holocaust.

I can't really explain it any better in written form. If you're still clueless I can have my daughter draw it out for you with crayons on pretty paper. The article is an atrocity to journalism, has 2 glaring lies in the title alone, and is pretty much why people are clueless to current affairs.

Re: Ridiculous Fox News Claim of the Day: Reason Caused the Holocaust
 

she doesn't know her soup from her nuts
http://www.politicalwrinkles.com/med...tml#post554981

Re: Ridiculous Fox News Claim of the Day: Reason Caused the Holocaust
 

I'm not here to debate whether moral relativism led us down the path to the Holocaust. I'm just knocking down the notion 1] Fox News never made the claim and 2] Nance never said reason led us to the Holocaust.

Re: Ridiculous Fox News Claim of the Day: Reason Caused the Holocaust
 

Actually, the quote is "Fox News Claim of the Day".
You are improperly inserting the word "made" into there where it doesn't belong.

Recognizing the claim was made ON Fox News matches the phrase above.
:rolls


Yes.
As in "Reason" was a necessary part of that chain

Age of Enlightenment and Reason => Moral Relativism => Holocaust.

You avoided my question.
WHY would she even mention "moral relativism" and "holocaust" if there was never ANY link to reason in her rant?
It's stupid to bring it up if she wasn't pretending there was a link. The issue had nothing to do with "moral relativism"...
... UNLESS SHE CLAIMED A LINK from "reason" => "moral relativism" in the first place... :rolls

All you're doing is repeating yourself.
I understand what you're saying. I just reject it as it's not a realistic interpretation of what happened.

Re: Ridiculous Fox News Claim of the Day: Reason Caused the Holocaust
 

to be fair she did say gave way and that leads one to believe she means one came after the other even if it wasn't precipitated by it. AS I have shown relativism did not follow enlightenment. Not in any way shape or form. it was around thousands of years before and as for modern versions did not come along until way after the holocaust. so yes she is like glen beck in her loose interpretation of history and philosophy.

Re: Ridiculous Fox News Claim of the Day: Reason Caused the Holocaust
 

B*llsh*t. Giving way to something doesn't mean it's a necessary part of any freakin' chain. You're making crap up now and stretching this to hysterical proportions. That or you don't know what "gave way" means.

You can twist and defend this all you want as long as you understand Fox News never made the claim and Nance did not say reason led to the Holocaust.

Re: Ridiculous Fox News Claim of the Day: Reason Caused the Holocaust
 

Doesn't necessarily mean.
But it can mean that.
And in this case, that's exactly what she did mean... :yes

I keep asking the question that you keep avoiding...
WHY would she even mention "moral relativism" and "holocaust" if there was never ANY link to reason in her rant?
It's stupid to bring it up if she wasn't pretending there was a link. The issue had nothing to do with "moral relativism"...
... UNLESS SHE CLAIMED A LINK from "reason" => "moral relativism" in the first place...
:yes

Re: Ridiculous Fox News Claim of the Day: Reason Caused the Holocaust
 

Having Foundit 66 as moderator here is like having the inmates run the nut house - guess we just need to bow down to him and Mikeyy and acknowledge that FOX . . . er faux (how clever) is BAD.
Cnredd doesn't have enough cojones to kick these **** heads out instead I get scolded. You can bite me just don't beg more CA$H from this CAT!:mad

Re: Ridiculous Fox News Claim of the Day: Reason Caused the Holocaust
 

Why don't you leave? We have all been here longer and this ain't a right wing site.

Re: Ridiculous Fox News Claim of the Day: Reason Caused the Holocaust
 

You know, I was on another political forum, a TRULY right-wing one, and there was a lady who had basically told me to leave if I didn't like that it was so right wing--I eventually did, but it made me upset that a forum that was supposed to be inviting to all mindsets would be alright with someone telling me to leave. I just think about that and now I think about what you've said here. That's all. Carry on.

Re: Ridiculous Fox News Claim of the Day: Reason Caused the Holocaust
 

I don't want TopCat to leave. His views often run contrary to my own but he isn't as harsh as some others and I dont want them to leave either. We have a good balance just I wish we could disagree w/o being down right nasty.

Re: Ridiculous Fox News Claim of the Day: Reason Caused the Holocaust
 

Kizzume, even if some of us don't come right out and say it, I will.
I truly enjoyed the video you posted earlier.
Watched it in it's entirety.
You speak well!
I enjoy your views even if some of them don't mesh with mine.
What you say about all mindsets hits home.
When I first came here, I'd get into a snit with certain members, but that's not what it's all about really, is it?
It's enjoying getting into what others think and feel about any particular subject or news of the day.

Salty, I feel the same as you.
Don't want Cat to leave.. and he knows that.

Re: Ridiculous Fox News Claim of the Day: Reason Caused the Holocaust
 

I have NO INTENTIONS of making this place the circlejerk you wish it to be...:no

There are PLENTY of places on the interwebs for your my-way-or-the-highway desires...This ain't one of them...:no :mad

Re: Ridiculous Fox News Claim of the Day: Reason Caused the Holocaust
 

Look, I understand being upset with a forum that FEELS like its being ran in one direction. At one time, I thought this was a right-wing forum because the people here on the right were so outspoken. I just had to stick around to see that I was wrong.

Let me assure you, the fact that there ARE liberal moderators here as well as conservative ones doesn't mean that the forum is suddenly going to be all about the liberal view. I know that some of you righties feel nervous around liberal mods, but this forum is run decently. If you stick around, you'll find out.

Re: Ridiculous Fox News Claim of the Day: Reason Caused the Holocaust
 

She didn't say it directly; BUT (And this requires a big but), the way she phrased that sentence, and given the fact that the topic had nothing at all to do with moral relatvism or the holocaust, Nance was most certainly hitting the connection she made up out of the blue with a very large "ImplyImplyImply" hammer. I can't read her mind, yet :devil , but given her worldview I think she seems like the kind of person that sees "reason" as a codeword for anti-religion and relativism, something to oppose according to her own ultra-conservative Christian outlook on life.

I could be wrong though.

Re: Ridiculous Fox News Claim of the Day: Reason Caused the Holocaust
 

He is used to being on forums were no thought that is not in lockstep is tolerated.

Re: Ridiculous Fox News Claim of the Day: Reason Caused the Holocaust
 

I don't disagree but this is a member who seems to want to trash people personally who don't buy their view. I don't know where they came from but they don't add anything to the site. I don't mind arguing points right, left or in between but I have limits on what I see as discourse. I don't have to agree with your politics to like you. The kind of person who PM's members to campaign against other members I have no use for. Besides that I like the mod squad here.:thumbsup

Re: Ridiculous Fox News Claim of the Day: Reason Caused the Holocaust
 

I know him from another fourm. Not that I care but I think he said something about me and Mikeyy and butt sex. That kinda stuff I think the mods should handle. Anyway, when you find someone who cannot tolerate any sort of different thought, you have run accross someone who is very insecure in his beiliefs. Really kinda sad so dont be too mean.

Re: Ridiculous Fox News Claim of the Day: Reason Caused the Holocaust
 

Like cnredd said, there are craploads of RW forums out there where they can kick libs or Obama all day long. They shouldn't go hunting on the web to find moderate forums to disrupt. IMHO

Re: Ridiculous Fox News Claim of the Day: Reason Caused the Holocaust
 

Oh, I guess I replied to his comment and did not see the rest of the thread. :o

Re: Ridiculous Fox News Claim of the Day: Reason Caused the Holocaust
 

Topcat's been around here for over five months and 1,000 posts.
He should have figured that out by now.... :yes

Quite frankly, I think it's b.s. that some conservatives claim problems (e.g. "nervous" as you put it) around liberal mods.
The funny thing is that there are liberals who claim the same thing regarding the conservative mods.
IMO, both examples are both sides trying to play the victim card where it doesn't belong. Akin to the "You are discriminating against me because I'm black / Christian / etc" card.
Neither right nor left mods exert that much muscle around here. The moderation is actually pretty lax compared to some forums I've seen.

Hearing some of these complaints is akin to:
:rolls

Re: Ridiculous Fox News Claim of the Day: Reason Caused the Holocaust
 

No it wasn't, and furthermore neither Fox News or Penny Nance said anything of the sort. This type of lying and misrepresentation is pretty typical of The Slate though. Surprised you fell for it.

Re: Ridiculous Fox News Claim of the Day: Reason Caused the Holocaust
 

It's already being covered elsewhere in the thread...

WHY would she even mention "moral relativism" and "holocaust" if there was never ANY link to reason in her rant?
It's stupid to bring it up if she wasn't pretending there was a link. The issue had nothing to do with "moral relativism"...
... UNLESS SHE CLAIMED A LINK from "reason" => "moral relativism" in the first place...

Re: Ridiculous Fox News Claim of the Day: Reason Caused the Holocaust
 

Sorry Foundit, I tried to give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you had been fooled or made a mistake, but it would appear that you are knowingly perpetuating a lie. Your reading comprehension skills are not nearly so bad that you actually believe that is what she said. If they were that bad you never would have gotten past "turn on power" in the instructions for your computer. I guess I thought, or was hoping, that this type of thing was beneath you.

Re: Ridiculous Fox News Claim of the Day: Reason Caused the Holocaust
 

You didn't answer the question.
Your response had no cogent, topical merit. :shrug
I've seen too many people go for personal attacks (as you just did) to avoid addressing the topic. It's not impressive and it doesn't fool anybody.

Answer the question...
WHY would she even mention "moral relativism" and "holocaust" if there was never ANY link to reason in her rant?
It's stupid to bring it up if she wasn't pretending there was a link. The issue had nothing to do with "moral relativism"...
... UNLESS SHE CLAIMED A LINK from "reason" => "moral relativism" in the first place...

Re: Ridiculous Fox News Claim of the Day: Reason Caused the Holocaust
 

Expect crickets now. :D

Re: Ridiculous Fox News Claim of the Day: Reason Caused the Holocaust
 

It's a stupid question, asked to help perpetuate the lie. Anybody with third grade reading comprehension can see that she was refering to a lack of reason, so claiming that she or Fox said "reason caused the holocaust" is a lie. You are knowingly perpetuating a lie making you a liar as well. As for the personnal attack, mild as it was, liars deserve it.

Re: Ridiculous Fox News Claim of the Day: Reason Caused the Holocaust
 

Only in that answering the question is not convenient for you...
It's akin to a wife asking "Why is there lipstick on your collar?" The fact that you don't want to answer doesn't invalidate the question.

I welcome you to answer the question and quote what she said which supposedly gives that interpretation.
Quite frankly, she was complaining about the "Day of Reason", listing all sorts of nonsense against it...

Can you say the word "lie" a few more times while avoiding my question? :rolls

You should know by now that I don't really care about personal attacks, except when people rely exclusively on them to avoid topical discussion which is what you're doing.
If all you're going to do is attack personally, you're boring me and proving yourself incapable of rational discussion.

Answer the question...
WHY would she even mention "moral relativism" and "holocaust" if there was never ANY link to reason in her rant?
It's stupid to bring it up if she wasn't pretending there was a link. The issue had nothing to do with "moral relativism"...
... UNLESS SHE CLAIMED A LINK from "reason" => "moral relativism" in the first place...

Re: Ridiculous Fox News Claim of the Day: Reason Caused the Holocaust
 

Perhaps you could ask a question that isn't based on a false premis. Your asking if the car is blue or red while pointing at a bike, then getting upset when someone calls you on the fact that your lying about the car.