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History, Geography, & Military Discuss Robots to Replace Troops on the Battlefield at the Political Forums; Originally Posted by saltwn war is senseless to an enlightened world. In an enlightened and mythical (and un-Biblical, since God ...

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Old 01-31-2014, 03:58 PM
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Default Re: Robots to Replace Troops on the Battlefield

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Originally Posted by saltwn View Post
war is senseless to an enlightened world.
In an enlightened and mythical (and un-Biblical, since God stated that we would always have wars) world, there would be no hunger, no pain, no suffering, no liberals, no conservatives, no war, nothing that would cause anyone to be unhappy. We do not live in such a place because we live in world where there are these people called "humans" and humans don't live in enlightened places because some of them like to take what isn't theirs, thus ruining the whole enlightenment thing. Those of us who are adults realize that we have to live in the real world and that the flying pink unicorns will just have wait for their riders to arrive.
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Old 01-31-2014, 04:02 PM
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Default Re: Robots to Replace Troops on the Battlefield

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Originally Posted by mlurp View Post
I guess a few here have never read Sun Tuz sense Iraq we have failed to follow his lead.
I have that downloaded on audio. Been meaning to read it. Is it good?
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Old 01-31-2014, 04:32 PM
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Default Re: Robots to Replace Troops on the Battlefield

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Originally Posted by Oftencold View Post
That sort of reminds me of when some people said that the cavalry would never be replaced.

In WWI there was a general, French I think, who relied on couriers and refused to use telephones because he claimed not to "understand the principle."
Your comparison is like a martinet saying killing the enemy will be replaced with something else. It does not compute. I suggest you read THE ART OF WAR, and study it.
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Old 02-05-2014, 12:53 PM
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Default Re: Robots to Replace Troops on the Battlefield

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Originally Posted by saltwn View Post
I have that downloaded on audio. Been meaning to read it. Is it good?
Get to listening to it salty.

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Originally Posted by mlurp View Post
I guess a few here have never read Sun Tuz sense Iraq we have failed to follow his lead.
Whom is credited with wrting the Art of War. Yet it might be a coupled from many years of great generals who fought for their states leaders till shortly after A.D., came along.

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war is senseless to an enlightened world.
And you think this world is enlightened salty?
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Old 06-22-2014, 07:04 PM
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Default Re: Robots to Replace Troops on the Battlefield

BBC News - 'Killer robots' to be debated at UN

Quote:
Killer robots will be debated during an informal meeting of experts at the United Nations in Geneva.
Two robotics experts, Prof Ronald Arkin and Prof Noel Sharkey, will debate the efficacy and necessity of killer robots.
The meeting will be held during the UN Convention on Certain Conventional Weapons (CCW).
A report on the discussion will be presented to the CCW meeting in November.
This will be the first time that the issue of killer robots, or lethal autonomous weapons systems, will be addressed within the CCW.
Continue reading the main story
“Start Quote
"I support a moratorium until that end is achieved, but I do not support a ban at this time" ”
Prof Ronald Arkin Georgia Institute of Technology

Autonomous kill function
A killer robot is a fully autonomous weapon that can select and engage targets without any human intervention. They do not currently exist but advances in technology are bringing them closer to reality.
Those in favour of killer robots believe the current laws of war may be sufficient to address any problems that might emerge if they are ever deployed, arguing that a moratorium, not an outright ban, should be called if this is not the case.
However, those who oppose their use believe they are a threat to humanity and any autonomous "kill functions" should be banned.
"Autonomous weapons systems cannot be guaranteed to predictably comply with international law," Prof Sharkey told the BBC. "Nations aren't talking to each other about this, which poses a big risk to humanity."
Prof Sharkey is a member and co-founder of the Campaign Against Killer Robots and chairman of the International Committee for Robot Arms Control.
Side events at the CCW will be hosted by the Campaign to Stop Killer Robots.

Automation of warfare
Prof Arkin from the Georgia Institute of Technology told the BBC he hoped killer robots would be able to significantly reduce non-combatant casualties but feared they would be rushed into battle before this was accomplished.
"I support a moratorium until that end is achieved, but I do not support a ban at this time," said Prof Arkin.
He went on to state that killer robots may be better able to determine when not to engage a target than humans, "and could potentially exercise greater care in so doing".
Prof Sharkey is less optimistic. "I'm concerned about the full automation of warfare," he says.

Drones
The discussion of drones is not on the agenda as they are yet to operate completely autonomously, although there are signs this may change in the near future.
The UK successfully tested the Taranis, an unmanned intercontinental aircraft in Australia this year and America's Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency (Darpa) has made advances with the Crusher, an unmanned ground combat vehicle, since 2006.
The MoD has claimed in the past that it currently has no intention of developing systems that operate without human intervention.
On 21 November 2012 the United States Defense Department issued a directive that, "requires a human being to be 'in-the-loop' when decisions are made about using lethal force," according to Human Rights Watch.
The meeting of experts will be chaired by French ambassador Jean-Hugues Simon-Michel from 13 to 16 May 2014.
Scientists Debate Killer Robots at U.N. Conference - NBC News

Scientists Debate Killer Robots at U.N. Conference - NBC News

Should the world kill killer robots before it’s too late? - The Washington Post

Only five countries actually want to ban killer robots | The Verge

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Old 06-22-2014, 07:49 PM
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Default Re: Robots to Replace Troops on the Battlefield

Another headline: Ancient post resurrected.

I will believe it when I see it.

Robots cost money, unfortunately (at least to some) human life is cheap.
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Old 06-22-2014, 08:22 PM
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Default Re: Robots to Replace Troops on the Battlefield

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Another headline: Ancient post resurrected.

I will believe it when I see it.

Robots cost money, unfortunately (at least to some) human life is cheap.
well ok but they are using drones to kill now. obviously someone thinks the cost are right. how much more money does it cost to make it "autonomous". another computer?

how much does it cost to train and keep a man and his weapons in the field/sea/sky for 3-4 years, plus the human maintenance after the service healthy or injured?
Compared to a a mobile weapon ALONE?

I don't know for sure but i'd suspect it'd be less in the long term.
But I'm sure people are doing the full accounting.
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Old 06-22-2014, 08:23 PM
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Default Re: Robots to Replace Troops on the Battlefield

at first i laughed but then... i stopped.
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Old 06-24-2014, 05:58 PM
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Default Re: Robots to Replace Troops on the Battlefield

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Originally Posted by mlurp View Post
I guess a few here have never read Sun Tuz sense Iraq we have failed to follow his lead.

I wrote this in January, I believe my point is being made today in Iraq.


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war is senseless to an enlightened world.
and it is a shame not all of this world is enlightened. Far to many want to go back in time...
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Old 11-10-2017, 07:40 PM
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Red face Re: Robots to Replace Troops on the Battlefield

UPDATE:

possum `fraid dat killer robot gonna get him...

UN to Host Talks on Use of 'Killer Robots'
November 10, 2017 — The United Nations is set to host talks on the use of autonomous weapons, but those hoping for a ban on the machines dubbed "killer robots" will be disappointed, the ambassador leading the discussions said Friday.
Quote:
More than 100 artificial intelligence entrepreneurs led by Tesla's Elon Musk in August urged the U.N. to enforce a global ban on fully automated weapons, echoing calls from activists who have warned the machines will put civilians at enormous risk. A U.N. disarmament grouping known as the Convention on Certain Conventional Weapons (CCW) will on Monday begin five days of talks on the issue in Geneva. But anything resembling a ban, or even a treaty, remains far off, said the Indian ambassador on disarmament, Amandeep Gill, who is chairing the meeting. "It would be very easy to just legislate a ban but I think ... rushing ahead in a very complex subject is not wise," he told reporters. "We are just at the starting line."


The mock killer robot was displayed in London in April 2013 during the launching of the Campaign to Stop Killer Robots, which calls for the ban of lethal robot weapons that would be able to select and attack targets without any human intervention.

He said the discussion, which will also include civil society and technology companies, will be partly focused on understanding the types of weapons in the pipeline. Proponents of a ban, including the Campaign to Stop Killer Robots pressure group, insist that human beings must ultimately be responsible for the final decision to kill or destroy. They argue that any weapons system that delegates the decision on an individual strike to an algorithm is by definition illegal, because computers cannot be held accountable under international humanitarian law. Gill said there was agreement that "human beings have to remain responsible for decisions that involve life and death." But, he added, there are varying opinions on the mechanics through which "human control" must govern deadly weapons.

Machines 'can't apply the law'

The International Committee of the Red Cross, which is mandated to safeguard the laws of conflict, has not called for a ban, but has underscored the need to place limits on autonomous weapons. "Our bottom line is that machines can't apply the law and you can't transfer responsibility for legal decisions to machines," Neil Davison of the ICRC's arms unit told AFP. He highlighted the problematic nature of weapons that involve major variables in terms of the timing or location of an attack — for example, something that is deployed for multiple hours and programmed to strike whenever it detects an enemy target. "Where you have a degree of unpredictability or uncertainty in what's going to happen when you activate this weapons system, then you are going to start to have problems for legal compliance," he said.

Flawed meeting?

Next week's U.N. meeting will also feature wide-ranging talks on artificial intelligence, triggering criticism that the CCW was drowning itself in discussions about new technologies instead of zeroing in on the urgent issue. "There is a risk in going too broad at this moment," said Mary Wareham of Human Rights Watch, who is the coordinator of the Campaign to Stop Killer Robots. "The need is to focus on lethal autonomous weapons," she told AFP. The open letter co-signed by Musk as well as Mustafa Suleyman, co-founder of Google's DeepMind, warned that killer robots could become "weapons that despots and terrorists use against innocent populations, and weapons hacked to behave in undesirable ways." "Once this Pandora's box is opened, it will be hard to close," they said.

https://www.voanews.com/a/united-nat...s/4110227.html
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