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Elections Discuss “Trump’s Next Coup Has Already Begun,” Reports Barton Gellman of The Atlantic at the Political Forums; Technically, the next attempt to overthrow a national election may not qualify as a coup. It will rely on subversion ...

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Old 12-16-2021, 08:44 AM
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Default “Trump’s Next Coup Has Already Begun,” Reports Barton Gellman of The Atlantic

Technically, the next attempt to overthrow a national election may not qualify as a coup. It will rely on subversion more than violence, although each will have its place. If the plot succeeds, the ballots cast by American voters will not decide the presidency in 2024. Thousands of votes will be thrown away, or millions, to produce the required effect. The winner will be declared the loser. The loser will be certified president-elect.

...

read the full article

“The democratic emergency is already here,” Richard L. Hasen, a professor of law and political science at UC Irvine, told me in late October. Hasen prides himself on a judicious temperament. Only a year ago he was cautioning me against hyperbole. Now he speaks matter-of-factly about the death of our body politic. “We face a serious risk that American democracy as we know it will come to an end in 2024,” he said, “but urgent action is not happening.”

...
By way of foundation for all the rest, Trump and his party have convinced a dauntingly large number of Americans that the essential workings of democracy are corrupt, that made-up claims of fraud are true, that only cheating can thwart their victory at the polls, that tyranny has usurped their government, and that violence is a legitimate response.
...
...

Gregory Dooner, who was selling flags at the protest, said he had been just outside the Capitol on January 6 as well. He used to sell ads for AT&T Advertising Solutions, and now, in retirement, he peddles MAGA gear: $10 for a small flag, $20 for a big one.

Violent political conflict, he told me, was inevitable, because Trump’s opponents “want actual war here in America. That’s what they want.” He added a slogan of the Three Percenters militia: “When tyranny becomes law, rebellion becomes duty.” The Declaration of Independence, which said something like that, was talking about King George III. If taken seriously today, the slogan calls for a war of liberation against the U.S. government.

“Yo, hey—hey,” Dooner called out to a customer who had just unfurled one of his banners. “I want to read him the flag.”

He recited the words inscribed on the Stars and Stripes: “A free people ought not only to be armed and disciplined but they should have sufficient arms and ammunition to maintain a status of independence from any who might attempt to abuse them, which would include their own government.”

“George Washington wrote that,” he said. “That’s where we’re at, gentlemen.”

I looked it up. George Washington did not write anything like that. The flag was Dooner’s best seller, even so.

...

...
That, I submit respectfully, is a profound misunderstanding of what mattered in the coup attempt a year ago. It is also a dangerous underestimate of the threat in 2024—which is larger, not smaller, than it was in 2020.

It is true that Trump tried and failed to wield his authority as commander in chief and chief law-enforcement officer on behalf of the Big Lie. But Trump did not need the instruments of office to sabotage the electoral machinery. It was citizen Trump—as litigant, as candidate, as dominant party leader, as gifted demagogue, and as commander of a vast propaganda army—who launched the insurrection and brought the peaceful transfer of power to the brink of failure.

All of these roles are still Trump’s for the taking. In nearly every battle space of the war to control the count of the next election—statehouses, state election authorities, courthouses, Congress, and the Republican Party apparatus—Trump’s position has improved since a year ago.

To understand the threat today, you have to see with clear eyes what happened, what is still happening, after the 2020 election. The charlatans and cranks who filed lawsuits and led public spectacles on Trump’s behalf were sideshows. They distracted from the main event: a systematic effort to nullify the election results and then reverse them. As milestones passed—individual certification by states, the meeting of the Electoral College on December 14—Trump’s hand grew weaker. But he played it strategically throughout. The more we learn about January 6, the clearer the conclusion becomes that it was the last gambit in a soundly conceived campaign—one that provides a blueprint for 2024.

The strategic objective of nearly every move by the Trump team after the networks called the election for Joe Biden on November 7 was to induce Republican legislatures in states that Biden won to seize control of the results and appoint Trump electors instead. Every other objective—in courtrooms, on state election panels, in the Justice Department, and in the office of the vice president—was instrumental to that end.

Electors are the currency in a presidential contest and, under the Constitution, state legislators control the rules for choosing them. Article II provides that each state shall appoint electors “in such Manner as the Legislature thereof may direct.” Since the 19th century, every state has ceded the choice to its voters, automatically certifying electors who support the victor at the polls, but in Bush v. Gore the Supreme Court affirmed that a state “can take back the power to appoint electors.” No court has ever said that a state could do that after its citizens have already voted, but that was the heart of Trump’s plan.

Every path to stealing the election required GOP legislatures in at least three states to repudiate the election results and substitute presidential electors for Trump. That act alone would not have ensured Trump’s victory. Congress would have had to accept the substitute electors when it counted the votes, and the Supreme Court might have had a say. But without the state legislatures, Trump had no way to overturn the verdict of the voters.

Trump needed 38 electors to reverse Biden’s victory, or 37 for a tie that would throw the contest to the House of Representatives. For all his improvisation and flailing in the postelection period, Trump never lost sight of that goal. He and his team focused on obtaining the required sum from among the 79 electoral votes in Arizona (11), Georgia (16), Michigan (16), Nevada (6), Pennsylvania (20), and Wisconsin (10)....

Pause for a moment to consider the choreography. Hundreds of angry men and women are swarming through the halls of the Capitol. They are fresh from victory in hand-to-hand combat with an outnumbered force of Metropolitan and Capitol Police. Many have knives or bear spray or baseball bats or improvised cudgels. A few have thought to carry zip-tie wrist restraints. Some are shouting “Hang Mike Pence!” Others call out hated Democrats by name.
...

It is difficult today to find a Republican elected official who will take issue with that proposition in public. With Trump loyalists ascendant, no room is left for dissent in a party now fully devoted to twisting the electoral system for the former president. Anyone who thinks otherwise need only glance toward Wyoming, where Liz Cheney, so recently in the party’s power elite, has been toppled from her leadership post and expelled from the state Republican Party for lèse-majesté.

In the first days of January 2021, as Trump and his legal advisers squeezed Pence to stop the electoral count, they told the vice president that state legislatures around the country were on the cusp of replacing electors who’d voted for Biden with those who would vote for Trump. They were lying, but they were trying mightily to make it true.
...

Today that reads like a coup plotter’s to-do list. Since the 2020 election, Trump’s acolytes have set about methodically identifying patches of resistance and pulling them out by the roots. Brad Raffensperger in Georgia, who refused to “find” extra votes for Trump? Formally censured by his state party, primaried, and stripped of his power as chief election officer. Aaron Van Langevelde in Michigan, who certified Biden’s victory? Hounded off the Board of State Canvassers. Governor Doug Ducey in Arizona, who signed his state’s “certificate of ascertainment” for Biden? Trump has endorsed a former Fox 10 news anchor named Kari Lake to succeed him, predicting that she “will fight to restore Election Integrity (both past and future!).” Future, here, is the operative word. Lake says she would not have certified Biden’s victory in Arizona, and even promises to revoke it (somehow) if she wins. None of this is normal.

Arizona’s legislature, meanwhile, has passed a law forbidding Katie Hobbs, the Democratic secretary of state, to take part in election lawsuits, as she did at crucial junctures last year. The legislature is also debating an extraordinary bill asserting its own prerogative, “by majority vote at any time before the presidential inauguration,” to “revoke the secretary of state’s issuance or certification of a presidential elector’s certificate of election.” There was no such thing under law as a method to “decertify” electors when Trump demanded it in 2020, but state Republicans think they have invented one for 2024.

In at least 15 more states, Republicans have advanced new laws to shift authority over elections from governors and career officials in the executive branch to the legislature. Under the Orwellian banner of “election integrity,” even more have rewritten laws to make it harder for Democrats to vote. Death threats and harassment from Trump supporters have meanwhile driven nonpartisan voting administrators to contemplate retirement.
...

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...
...

Donald trump came closer than anyone thought he could to toppling a free election a year ago. He is preparing in plain view to do it again, and his position is growing stronger. Republican acolytes have identified the weak points in our electoral apparatus and are methodically exploiting them. They have set loose and now are driven by the animus of tens of millions of aggrieved Trump supporters who are prone to conspiracy thinking, embrace violence, and reject democratic defeat. Those supporters, Robert Pape’s “committed insurrectionists,” are armed and single-minded and will know what to do the next time Trump calls upon them to act.

...

The midterms, marked by gerrymandering, will more than likely tighten the GOP’s grip on the legislatures in swing states. The Supreme Court may be ready to give those legislatures near-absolute control over the choice of presidential electors. And if Republicans take back the House and Senate, as oddsmakers seem to believe they will, the GOP will be firmly in charge of counting the electoral votes.

Against Biden or another Democratic nominee, Donald Trump may be capable of winning a fair election in 2024. He does not intend to take that chance.
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Old 12-16-2021, 08:45 AM
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Default Re: “Trump’s Next Coup Has Already Begun,” Reports Barton Gellman of The Atlantic

Here's an interview w author; it may hit more highlights


Barton Gellman was among the journalists who predicted in 2020 that President Trump would not admit defeat if he lost the presidential election. Now, in a cover story for The Atlantic, Gellman says the former president is in an even better position to seize power. He speaks with Hari Sreenivasan about why he believes democracy will be on trial in the 2024 presidential election.

Originally aired on December 10, 2021.
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Old 12-16-2021, 11:59 AM
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Default Re: “Trump’s Next Coup Has Already Begun,” Reports Barton Gellman of The Atlantic

From the OP...

Quote:
“The democratic emergency is already here,” Richard L. Hasen, a professor of law and political science at UC Irvine, told me in late October. Hasen prides himself on a judicious temperament. Only a year ago he was cautioning me against hyperbole. Now he speaks matter-of-factly about the death of our body politic. “We face a serious risk that American democracy as we know it will come to an end in 2024,” he said, “but urgent action is not happening.”
And what's really happening...

Why Is the Left Worried Suddenly About the End of Democracy?

Quote:
What is behind recent pessimistic appraisals of democracy’s future, from Hillary Clinton, Adam Schiff, Brian Williams and other elite intellectuals, media personalities, and politicians on the Left? Some are warning about its possible erosion in 2024. Others predict the democracy downturn as early 2022, with scary scenarios of “autocracy” and Trump “coups.”

To answer that question, understand first what is not behind these shrill forecasts.

They are not worried about 2 million foreign nationals crashing the border in a single year, without vaccinations during a pandemic. Yet it seems insurrectionary for a government simply to nullify its own immigration laws.

They are not worried that some 800,000 foreign nationals, some residing illegally, will now vote in New York City elections.

They are not worried that there are formal efforts to dismantle the U.S. Constitution by junking the 233-year-old Electoral College or the preeminence of the states in establishing ballot laws in national elections.

They are not worried that we are witnessing an unprecedented left-wing effort to scrap the 180-year-old filibuster, the 150-year-old nine-person Supreme Court, and the 60-year tradition of 50 states, for naked political advantage.

...What then is behind this new left-wing hysteria about the supposed looming end of democracy?

It is quite simple. The Left expects to lose power over the next two years—both because of the way it gained and used it, and because of its radical, top-down agendas that never had any public support.

After gaining control of both houses of Congress and the presidency—with an obsequious media and the support of Wall Street, Silicon Valley, higher education, popular culture, entertainment and professional sports—the Left has managed in just 11 months to alienate a majority of voters.

The nation has been wracked by unprecedented crime and nonenforcement of the borders. Leftist district attorneys either won’t indict criminals or let them out of jails or both.

Illegal immigration and inflation are soaring. Deliberate cuts in gas and oil production helped to spike fuel prices.

All this bad news is on top of the Afghanistan disaster, worsening racial relations, and an enfeebled president.

Democrats are running 10 points behind the Republicans in generic polls—with the midterms less than a year away.

oe Biden’s negatives run between 50 and 57 percent—in Donald Trump’s own former underwater territory.

Less than a third of the country wishes Biden to run for reelection. In many head-to-head polls, Trump now defeats Biden.

In other words, leftist elites are terrified that democracy will work too robustly.

After the Russian collusion hoax, the two impeachments, the Hunter Biden laptop stories, the staged melodramas of the Kavanaugh hearings, the Jussie Smollett con, the Covington kids smear, and the Rittenhouse trial race frenzy, the people are not just worn out by leftist hysterias, but also weary of how the Left gains power and administers it.

If Joe Biden were polling 70 percent approval, and his policies 60 percent, the current doomsayers would be reassuring us of the “health of the system.”

They are fearful and angry not because democracy does not work, but because it does despite their own media and political efforts to warp it.
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Old 12-16-2021, 12:28 PM
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Default Re: “Trump’s Next Coup Has Already Begun,” Reports Barton Gellman of The Atlantic

Quote:
Originally Posted by cnredd View Post
From the OP...

And what's really happening...

Why Is the Left Worried Suddenly About the End of Democracy?
The all voter suppression laws being passed and Trump meddling in state and federal primaries so that that next guy who has to make a decision to go with the constitution or go with trump, may not work completely but it may make it close enough that the votes he steals will be waved off with the hand that he fed.

Immigrants?
The most immigrants we have are from Syria and trump's buck buddy's holocaust war there.
There are people waiting for those jobs to start up right here near me. The plans have been made for them since before 2016 when the popular potus was in office, but the mitch coalition stalled them.
The money is now breaking.
Biden will be popular again that is why trump is hedging his bets. God help us all.
You are so scared of the white disappearing you overlook the real situation.
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Old 12-16-2021, 01:08 PM
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Default Re: “Trump’s Next Coup Has Already Begun,” Reports Barton Gellman of The Atlantic

Don't feed trolls or leftists, people.
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Old 12-16-2021, 04:37 PM
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Default Re: “Trump’s Next Coup Has Already Begun,” Reports Barton Gellman of The Atlantic

Quote:
Originally Posted by saltwn View Post
The all voter suppression laws being passed and Trump meddling in state and federal primaries so that that next guy who has to make a decision to go with the constitution or go with trump, may not work completely but it may make it close enough that the votes he steals will be waved off with the hand that he fed.

Immigrants?
The most immigrants we have are from Syria and trump's buck buddy's holocaust war there.
There are people waiting for those jobs to start up right here near me. The plans have been made for them since before 2016 when the popular potus was in office, but the mitch coalition stalled them.
The money is now breaking.
Biden will be popular again that is why trump is hedging his bets. God help us all.
You are so scared of the white disappearing you overlook the real situation.
Trump started the Afghanistan war??? News to me!!!

Biden has NEVER been popular. And now, at 22%, he is beyond hope of redemption.

And please cut out the racist crap. Your vacuous arguments are diminished enough without that.
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Old 12-17-2021, 09:40 AM
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Default Re: “Trump’s Next Coup Has Already Begun,” Reports Barton Gellman of The Atlantic

Quote:
Originally Posted by cnredd View Post
From the OP...

And what's really happening...

Why Is the Left Worried Suddenly About the End of Democracy?
Don't forget the lawfare campaign conducted by the Perkins Couie thugs that laundered Hillary's payments to the creators of the Steele dossier. Headed by uber election fixer Marc Elias Democrats succeeded in undermining election integrity measures like signature verification bypassing legislation in favor of court decrees and coerced consent decrees.

Democrats spent an estimated $50 million rewarding election fixers in the 2020 election with more to come battling election reforms like voter ID.
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Old 12-20-2021, 11:04 AM
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Default Re: “Trump’s Next Coup Has Already Begun,” Reports Barton Gellman of The Atlantic

Quote:
Originally Posted by cnredd View Post
From the OP...

And what's really happening...

Why Is the Left Worried Suddenly About the End of Democracy?

Yep, Democrats are setting themselves up to be the victims because they know their polices and demeaners are going to cause huge loses for the foreseeable future unless they do a 180 and become what real Americans want.
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Old 12-20-2021, 11:07 AM
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Default Re: “Trump’s Next Coup Has Already Begun,” Reports Barton Gellman of The Atlantic

Quote:
Originally Posted by AZRWinger View Post
Don't forget the lawfare campaign conducted by the Perkins Couie thugs that laundered Hillary's payments to the creators of the Steele dossier. Headed by uber election fixer Marc Elias Democrats succeeded in undermining election integrity measures like signature verification bypassing legislation in favor of court decrees and coerced consent decrees.

Democrats spent an estimated $50 million rewarding election fixers in the 2020 election with more to come battling election reforms like voter ID.
Maybe when the Vaccine ID's come out, they can add election info to it.

Or will they make excuses for all the people unable to get vaccine ID's?
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Old 12-22-2021, 10:26 PM
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Default Re: “Trump’s Next Coup Has Already Begun,” Reports Barton Gellman of The Atlantic

technically there was no coup or attempted coup on jan 6.
no one not in power tried to seize power from the government.
the peaceful transfer of power wasn't even to take place for a couple of weeks.
so technically if the protesters/rioters were trump's minions who were they seizing power from? trump was legally still in power at that point. delaying the certification of an election does not change any of that.
call it a protest or a riot and you have a point.
calling it a coup or an attempted coup and you just sound like a phucking retard.
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