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Economics Discuss Itís No Accident Americans Are Still Broke in a Booming Economy at the Political Forums; Originally Posted by saltwn A standard Bell telephone bill was $15 a month. But no that did not change the ...

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Old 07-11-2018, 07:32 AM
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Default Re: Itís No Accident Americans Are Still Broke in a Booming Economy

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Originally Posted by saltwn View Post
A standard Bell telephone bill was $15 a month. But no that did not change the way people can survive. We always had fads. CB radios. Tape decks, mini tape players and so on. Deregulation killed a lot but there were other factors. One was that entry level pay was stagnant for 10+ years while the real col was not. And they're lying that we do not have inflation today. Look at meat prices.
If one cannot afford to foster a 'fad', then why should other people pay for it?

Dave1 nailed it. Minimum wage is not where an adult should be. If they are working for minimum wage, then the problem is with them, not the employer, and the ripple effect that happens when you raise minimum wage makes the increase moot very quickly.

I've said it before, and I'll say it again, because maybe you missed it the first 500 times: The only group who benefits from an increase in minimum wage is the taxing authorities.
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Old 07-11-2018, 07:54 AM
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Default Re: Itís No Accident Americans Are Still Broke in a Booming Economy

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If one cannot afford to foster a 'fad', then why should other people pay for it?

Dave1 nailed it. Minimum wage is not where an adult should be. If they are working for minimum wage, then the problem is with them, not the employer, and the ripple effect that happens when you raise minimum wage makes the increase moot very quickly.

I've said it before, and I'll say it again, because maybe you missed it the first 500 times: The only group who benefits from an increase in minimum wage is the taxing authorities.


It is much easier for our government to legislate a minimum wage than to create an environment of prosperity by "promoting the general welfare" as they are missioned to do.
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Old 07-11-2018, 08:02 AM
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Default Re: Itís No Accident Americans Are Still Broke in a Booming Economy

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It is much easier for our government to legislate a minimum wage than to create an environment of prosperity by "promoting the general welfare" as they are missioned to do.
It's also to their political advantage as it works to appease the lesser informed voters that believe by simply demanding a higher wage, will somehow make their lives better. It is essentially a form of vote buying.
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Old 07-11-2018, 09:22 PM
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Default Re: Itís No Accident Americans Are Still Broke in a Booming Economy

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minimum wages are for kids not adults, stop pretending that type of labor is more valuable.....
I often wonder how adults earning minimum wage avoided Darwinism so as to last this long. Then I remember, liberals promote science and evolution, but don't actually like the evolution part where the weakest of the species would die off and allow the rest of us to progress. And they have the gall to call themselves "progressives" as they do everything that they can to weaken our species and our natural progression.
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Old 07-11-2018, 10:27 PM
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Default Re: Itís No Accident Americans Are Still Broke in a Booming Economy

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If one cannot afford to foster a 'fad', then why should other people pay for it?
my point here is we have always had fads and that did not make our economy tank.
Dave1 nailed it. Minimum wage is not where an adult should be. If they are working for minimum wage, then the problem is with them, not the employer, and the ripple effect that happens when you raise minimum wage makes the increase moot very quickly.

I've said it before, and I'll say it again, because maybe you missed it the first 500 times: The only group who benefits from an increase in minimum wage is the taxing authorities.
No. People have sh*t happen and have to take a second job and maybe all they can find is minimum wage. Not only did Reagan mess that up but he welcomed in more immigrants to take jobs away from desperately poor American individuals who did work in fields for farmers.
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Old 07-12-2018, 12:49 PM
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Default Re: Itís No Accident Americans Are Still Broke in a Booming Economy

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No. People have sh*t happen and have to take a second job and maybe all they can find is minimum wage. Not only did Reagan mess that up but he welcomed in more immigrants to take jobs away from desperately poor American individuals who did work in fields for farmers.
So a MW job is not their primary income. OK. And if they stay at MW for more then a month or two, then they are not doing the job very well, are they?

You still aren't seeing the underlying issue here, or you are just willfully ignoring it. But your choice, I guess, now that you are retired, it really doesn't have an effect of you.

Now, about those immigrants taking away American jobs......
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Old 07-12-2018, 01:09 PM
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Default Re: Itís No Accident Americans Are Still Broke in a Booming Economy

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You do realize: Lower unemployment means people will be paid more in a employer-competitive market.
The reality is that when accounting for inflation, wages have been stagnant for decades. This covers time periods of "lower unemployment" as well.
For most workers, real wages have barely budged for decades | Pew Research Center
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/...ob-market.html

The U.S. worker is one of the hardest working groups on the planet, but the wages do not grow proportionately.

We used to live in a country where the husband goes to work and the wife stays home and takes care of the children. And they could get by with such a situation.
Today's economy sees an essential requirement that both husband and wife need to be employed...
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Old 07-12-2018, 01:17 PM
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Default Re: Itís No Accident Americans Are Still Broke in a Booming Economy

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Originally Posted by saltwn View Post
No. People have sh*t happen and have to take a second job and maybe all they can find is minimum wage. Not only did Reagan mess that up but he welcomed in more immigrants to take jobs away from desperately poor American individuals who did work in fields for farmers.
You either need to do better research or perhaps stop lying. Reagan did not welcome MORE immigrants. He made a deal with Congress to give amnesty to the "Illegal" Immigrants already here in exchange for future legislation to strengthen the border security and immigration control. The Democratically controlled Congress reneged and provided neither.

The American people have been promised immigration reform, by every presidential candidate, ever since. No president until Trump has even tried to keep that campaign promise. And look at what Trump is facing, from people like you, for doing so.
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Old 07-12-2018, 01:53 PM
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Default Re: Itís No Accident Americans Are Still Broke in a Booming Economy

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The reality is that when accounting for inflation, wages have been stagnant for decades. This covers time periods of "lower unemployment" as well.
For most workers, real wages have barely budged for decades | Pew Research Center
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/...ob-market.html

The U.S. worker is one of the hardest working groups on the planet, but the wages do not grow proportionately.

We used to live in a country where the husband goes to work and the wife stays home and takes care of the children. And they could get by with such a situation.
Today's economy sees an essential requirement that both husband and wife need to be employed...
Both husband and wife need to be employed.//! And why is that?

Not because incomes are down but because costs are up. Much of that is taxes, fees and regulations

Married women didn't go to work in the eighties because of poverty. They did so because of changes in social norms, and of the expectations of women being "more than just a housewife." Bras were burned and jobs were plentiful. Despite the influx of new labor, unemployment remained low because manufacturing and service industries were booming.

Those were the terrible years of the Reagan economy that boomed through most of the Clinton economy. Some of which left the USA thanks to NAFTA and a Labor secretary who said "Americans don't need these dirty jobs."

Back then, Americans didn't fork over 60% of their paychecks to Local, State and Federal governments like today. Back then local sales taxes were 2%,3% now they are as much as 10%. Social Security, the real theft of our incomes is 15%.

And anyone who works for wages pays that subtle income tax at even the lowest of pay grades. And virtually no one thinks of it as the burdensome mandatory income tax of which it is.

This is why socialism never works Because it consumes the fruits of the people's labor. So long as our government spends more than it receives, it will demand more from the people in the name of the "Better Good."

And the follish will believe it righteous and patriotic to do so.
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Old 07-12-2018, 04:48 PM
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Default Re: Itís No Accident Americans Are Still Broke in a Booming Economy

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Originally Posted by foundit66 View Post
The reality is that when accounting for inflation, wages have been stagnant for decades. This covers time periods of "lower unemployment" as well.
For most workers, real wages have barely budged for decades | Pew Research Center
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/...ob-market.html

The U.S. worker is one of the hardest working groups on the planet, but the wages do not grow proportionately.

We used to live in a country where the husband goes to work and the wife stays home and takes care of the children. And they could get by with such a situation.
Today's economy sees an essential requirement that both husband and wife need to be employed...
OK, quick jolt to today, shall we?
Are you making the same wages you were 10 years ago? 5 Years ago? I know I'm not, nor is anybody I am acquainted with.

What the reality is, is wages are not 'stagnant', it's inflation is happening faster then what the market was willing to pay for the labor. When someone's skillset is basic, they will be at the bottom of the ladder because pretty much everybody has that skillset. Move up, and fewer and fewer people will have that particular skillset, therefore there value goes up.

Now, take a market where there are more jobs then available workers. Like, right now. In order to entice the worker to fill a position, even with the lowest skillset, an employer will offer to pay more, and that ripples up to all skillsets.

Wages go up.... but so will inflation, because the cost of producing the consumer goods and services go up. The benefiting party is the taxing authority, who does not have to provide additional services or products, but gets additional funds based on other people's incomes. There is some rising costs in labor for the taxing authority, but they are minimal compared to the consumer market. They also have a captive audience, since virtual no one is 'exempt' from paying some income taxes*

*Do I really need to spell out the caveats on this statement?

Current society, as a general statement, is consumer driven, regardless of household income, norms were different 60 years ago, where wearing hand-me-downs from siblings was perfectly normal, things were repaired rather then replaced, 'making do' was a standard, and people did not go into debt as easily or as quickly as they do now. It used to be that if you couldn't pay for it out right, you didn't need it, where today it's all about gotta have it now, bigger and better.


There are also the factors that others have brought up, the actual mindset of society today, who believe that to have a value in society, you must make an income.
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