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Economics Discuss GOP tax cut not why economy is booming at the Political Forums; Originally Posted by saltwn I disagree. see my last posts. you must have revenue. we owe money even w/o services ...

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Old 05-22-2018, 07:18 AM
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Default Re: GOP tax cut not why economy is booming

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Originally Posted by saltwn View Post
I disagree. see my last posts.

you must have revenue.
we owe money even w/o services
Your post was what I was responding too.

The government needs to trim itself to live within the money that it collects, not just collect more to pay for every boondoggle and giveaway that politicians use to entice people to vote for them. The Federal Gov't needs to be held to it's Constitutional mandates and quit trying to be the nanny of a depend nation full of free loaders. The gov't is NOT a charity and needs to get out of that business.
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Old 05-22-2018, 09:48 AM
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Default Re: GOP tax cut not why economy is booming

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Originally Posted by saltwn View Post
re your reply about what taxes to raise.. all of them and heres why. rich cant do it alone if you look at the math. that is why politicians wont tell you the truth. after the few fixes in 2009 that mostly bailed out private companies they should have come clean to the american people and said 'look,we can fix the economy but we have to cut cut cut services and raise taxes on everyone, welfare, veterans, social security recipients and rich and middle class.'

with a sunset provision
then leave a smaller tax across the board and keep all cuts across the board while we fix infrastructure.
Come on Salty, you know Democrats will never allow cuts. Even if a department is unable to use the money they take in, they are still going to get a higher percentage the following year, and the year after that. Even if they say that they do not need anymore money, they will be told to shut up and spend frivolously if they have to. This is why you hear about 800.00 hammers and toilet seats.

Tax dollars HAVE to be spent, weather they need to or not. This is because of lying, conniving, politicians that are lining their pockets. Why do you think Planned parenthood is able to make million dollar donations to Liberal Politicians? Because they take in far more money then they need.

I'll repeat the truth people here are saying. THERE IS NO REVENUE PROBLEM, THERE IS A PROBLEM WITH SPENDING AND CHEATING THE SYSTEM.

If I was addicted to gambling, and told you that I could not afford my rent, would you feel sorry for me and help me pay my rent? Or would you tell me to quit gambling and use that money to pay my own rent?

Politicians, and Government run entities are ADDICTED to spending. THAT is the problem.
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Old 05-22-2018, 12:41 PM
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Default Re: GOP tax cut not why economy is booming

Quote:
Originally Posted by GetAClue View Post
Your post was what I was responding too.

The government needs to trim itself to live within the money that it collects, not just collect more to pay for every boondoggle and giveaway that politicians use to entice people to vote for them. The Federal Gov't needs to be held to it's Constitutional mandates and quit trying to be the nanny of a depend nation full of free loaders. The gov't is NOT a charity and needs to get out of that business.
Sadly we have drifted so far from the restraints on the Federal government traditionally recognized as necessary to maintain the Republic. A balanced budget amendment is necessary to insure deficit spending orgies do not reemerge. From George Will

Quote:
Democracy generally, and especially legislative bargaining, is inherently additive: Majorities are assembled by attracting components with particularized benefits. Christopher DeMuth, president emeritus of the American Enterprise Institute, notes that from the Founding to the 1930s-1960s New Deal-Great Society era, this natural tendency of government to grow was inhibited by the bipartisan political ethic: Deficits were neither prudent nor seemly except when "borrowing was limited to wars, other emergencies, and investments such as territorial expansion and transportation; and incurred debts were paid down diligently."

This tradition of borrowing for the future dissipated as government began routinely borrowing from the future in order to finance current consumption of government goods and services. DeMuth argues that a balanced-budget amendment is required because of the transformation of government from a provider of public goods (defense, infrastructure) to a provider of benefits (money and services) directly to individuals.
https://www-washingtonpost-com.cdn.a...175_story.html

The last serious effort at a balanced budget amendment was by the Republican controlled House during the fight with the Obama administration over raising the debt ceiling. It was condemned as racists attacking Obama the noble warrior for the welfare state. After so-called moderate Republicans collapsed to Democrats demands for a "clean" debt ceiling hike the US suffered its first credit downgrade ever.
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Old 05-22-2018, 01:03 PM
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Default Re: GOP tax cut not why economy is booming

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Originally Posted by AZRWinger View Post
Sadly we have drifted so far from the restraints on the Federal government traditionally recognized as necessary to maintain the Republic. A balanced budget amendment is necessary to insure deficit spending orgies do not reemerge. From George Will



https://www-washingtonpost-com.cdn.a...175_story.html

The last serious effort at a balanced budget amendment was by the Republican controlled House during the fight with the Obama administration over raising the debt ceiling. It was condemned as racists attacking Obama the noble warrior for the welfare state. After so-called moderate Republicans collapsed to Democrats demands for a "clean" debt ceiling hike the US suffered its first credit downgrade ever.
Yep, happens every single time a republicans talks about spending limits. The left and the Media labels them, Racists, Misogynists, child haters, haters of the poor., etc.... EVERY TIME!!!!

Maybe one of the brilliant lefties here can tell us how to get past this fact, without saying raise taxes.
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Old 05-22-2018, 01:40 PM
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Default Re: GOP tax cut not why economy is booming

There is a logical fallacy known as the post hoc ergo propter hoc fallacy ("after it, therefore because of it"). It is prone to confuse causation with mere correlation--or even coincidence--or it may be that causation (if it truly exists) runs the other way: i.e. B caused A, rather than the other way around.

But there is also a logical fallacy known as the a priori fallacy. Basically, it describes a preconceived belief, which no amount of evidence to the contrary can dislodge.

I think it is the latter that may be at play here...
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Old 05-22-2018, 01:41 PM
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Default Re: GOP tax cut not why economy is booming

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Originally Posted by GetAClue View Post
Your post was what I was responding too.

The government needs to trim itself to live within the money that it collects, not just collect more to pay for every boondoggle and giveaway that politicians use to entice people to vote for them. The Federal Gov't needs to be held to it's Constitutional mandates and quit trying to be the nanny of a depend nation full of free loaders. The gov't is NOT a charity and needs to get out of that business.
agreed, agreed, agreed X's nth degree

but to actually 'fix' the economy after the big recession of 2008 (remember we have been kicking cans down the road and doing quick midnight fixes ever since), we need higher taxes across the board till
we're in the black.
That's not gonna happen any more than slashing entitlements/ services will, but that's the way to fix it.
Then we can move on to a better tax bill and decide what we need.
from that point onward
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Old 05-22-2018, 02:03 PM
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Default Re: GOP tax cut not why economy is booming

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Originally Posted by Dog Man View Post
Come on Salty, you know Democrats will never allow cuts. Even if a department is unable to use the money they take in, they are still going to get a higher percentage the following year, and the year after that. Even if they say that they do not need anymore money, they will be told to shut up and spend frivolously if they have to. This is why you hear about 800.00 hammers and toilet seats.
Perhaps if capitalists didn't go up and up on food and energy prices, they could hold the line. or if we impress on people the cost of too many children on society.
Quote:
Tax dollars HAVE to be spent, weather they need to or not. This is because of lying, conniving, politicians that are lining their pockets. Why do you think Planned parenthood is able to make million dollar donations to Liberal Politicians? Because they take in far more money then they need.
Quote:
I'll repeat the truth people here are saying. THERE IS NO REVENUE PROBLEM, THERE IS A PROBLEM WITH SPENDING AND CHEATING THE SYSTEM.

pick what to keep, what revenue to cut.
If I was addicted to gambling, and told you that I could not afford my rent, would you feel sorry for me and help me pay my rent? Or would you tell me to quit gambling and use that money to pay my own rent?

Politicians, and Government run entities are ADDICTED to spending. THAT is the problem.[/QUOTE]

Then quit defending business which has sucked the life out f this country. they got unions squashed and many laws changed/ mentality has eroded their thinking to believe employees are not exactly quite human
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Old 05-23-2018, 06:32 PM
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Default Re: GOP tax cut not why economy is booming

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Originally Posted by Dog Man View Post
Yep, happens every single time a republicans talks about spending limits. The left and the Media labels them, Racists, Misogynists, child haters, haters of the poor., etc.... EVERY TIME!!!!

Maybe one of the brilliant lefties here can tell us how to get past this fact, without saying raise taxes.
You forgot about killing the elderly.

We are into the second year of a GOP controlled Presidency, House and Senate.
Where are the spending cuts that are needed? Where is the fiscal responsibility that so many Republican congresscritters espouse? Congress controls the spending, where are the cuts?
Heck, I'd almost be happy if they simply took the stand that the federal budget were to stay exactly the same, no increase in spending.
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Old 05-23-2018, 06:51 PM
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Default Re: GOP tax cut not why economy is booming

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You forgot about killing the elderly.

We are into the second year of a GOP controlled Presidency, House and Senate.
Where are the spending cuts that are needed? Where is the fiscal responsibility that so many Republican congresscritters espouse? Congress controls the spending, where are the cuts?
Heck, I'd almost be happy if they simply took the stand that the federal budget were to stay exactly the same, no increase in spending.
the elderly have been killed. what do you think the high gas prices and high cost of meat does for them?
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Old 05-23-2018, 07:02 PM
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Default Re: GOP tax cut not why economy is booming

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Images such as this with an obligatory "pick what to keep, pick what to cut" are disingenuous. The intent is to pretend that nothing can be cut because it will hurt some service or need.
The reality is that every one of those spending "groups" has room for reduced spending. That reduced spending needs to occur at the detailed level.
Does a Social Security office really need to spend $250 every month on grounds maintenance? (<-- that is an actual expense for one of the SS offices in my city, one of them, and the city has many of them) Or can they get by with spending $100 a month? Multiply that savings by every SS office in the country. Then start including things like janitorial service, parking lot maintenance, filing (yes, despite the fact that most things are electronic, we still have file clerks at SS offices), the list goes on.
Bullspit and overpaid expenses exist all over government. It's not about removing the actual service (Social Security), it's about removing the Bee Ess expenses around it.
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