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Economics Discuss The Dow just hit an all-time high, as the GOP tax plan fuels economic optimism at the Political Forums; Originally Posted by Bat I'm not an economist but by nature and profession I am an analyst. In a way, ...

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Old 01-19-2018, 06:16 AM
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Default Re: The Dow just hit an all-time high, as the GOP tax plan fuels economic optimism

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Originally Posted by Bat View Post
I'm not an economist but by nature and profession I am an analyst.
In a way, President Obama was handed the perfect "storm" economically when he took office. Things were so bad (economically) that it would be almost impossible for him to make them worse. The economy IS cyclical, it goes up and it goes down. President Obama inherited a severe down cycle at the bottom and enjoyed a slow up cycle during his presidency. President Trump inherited an up cycle economy. So far, the cycle continues the upward trend. His policies are intended to create more up cycle. So far, they have. But since economical conditions are cyclical, eventually the economy will retreat in some manner. It's just a matter of how much and how far.
And, a President only has limited control over the economy, Congress actually has more control.
Look at whom controlled congress during economic success and economic failure if you want to know the answers.
You are right that Congress has more control over the economy than the president does. However the President can set an agenda and drive legislation through Congress to effect their actions. Obama did this in an attempt to push through big dollar social programs and also put severe limits on business through bureaucratic red tape.

Trump is making a 180 degree turn to those policies by rolling back regulations and by pushing a pro business agenda in Congress (Tax reform). This ultimately has a great effect on how the economy responds and we are seeing that with growth in the private sector unlike we have seen in years. From businesses voluntarily paying bonuses and raising wages, to the repatriation of investments back into our economy (Apple). This was not initiated by anyone in Congress and I would speculate that had Clinton won the election, none of this would be happening now even if make up of the Congress were the same as it currently is. The difference is the President.
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Old 01-19-2018, 09:28 AM
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Default Re: The Dow just hit an all-time high, as the GOP tax plan fuels economic optimism

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Originally Posted by Bat View Post
I'm not an economist but by nature and profession I am an analyst.
In a way, President Obama was handed the perfect "storm" economically when he took office. Things were so bad (economically) that it would be almost impossible for him to make them worse. The economy IS cyclical, it goes up and it goes down. President Obama inherited a severe down cycle at the bottom and enjoyed a slow up cycle during his presidency. President Trump inherited an up cycle economy. So far, the cycle continues the upward trend. His policies are intended to create more up cycle. So far, they have. But since economical conditions are cyclical, eventually the economy will retreat in some manner. It's just a matter of how much and how far.
And, a President only has limited control over the economy, Congress actually has more control.
Look at whom controlled congress during economic success and economic failure if you want to know the answers.
Obama and his supporters brag about saving the US from the next Great Depression. In fact the recession ended roughly 9 months after Obama took office far too soon for his stimulus pork barrel spending to take effect.

Nonetheless Obama found a way to make the recovery the worst since the Great Depression by exploding the debt and with an open hostility towards any kind of fiscal management. In addition to record welfare costs, Obama promoted stagnant economic growth as the new normal.

Free market economies are in a constant state of change thanks to capital reallocation. As we have seen with Trump's rolling back regulations and welcoming businesses, government meddling in the economy is far more likely to make things worse than help. Obama expanded government control over businesses. Trump reduced it. The difference in results tells the story.
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Old 01-19-2018, 06:17 PM
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Default Re: The Dow just hit an all-time high, as the GOP tax plan fuels economic optimism

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Originally Posted by GetAClue View Post
You are right that Congress has more control over the economy than the president does. However the President can set an agenda and drive legislation through Congress to effect their actions. Obama did this in an attempt to push through big dollar social programs and also put severe limits on business through bureaucratic red tape.

Trump is making a 180 degree turn to those policies by rolling back regulations and by pushing a pro business agenda in Congress (Tax reform). This ultimately has a great effect on how the economy responds and we are seeing that with growth in the private sector unlike we have seen in years. From businesses voluntarily paying bonuses and raising wages, to the repatriation of investments back into our economy (Apple). This was not initiated by anyone in Congress and I would speculate that had Clinton won the election, none of this would be happening now even if make up of the Congress were the same as it currently is. The difference is the President.
We are both right.
The tax reform and repatriation of monies/investment are and will continue to better our economy. And yes, it was driven by President Trump. Congress did have to act on it. If he was dealing with a democrat controlled congress we probably wouldn't be seeing the positive activity and results.
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Old 01-19-2018, 06:34 PM
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Default Re: The Dow just hit an all-time high, as the GOP tax plan fuels economic optimism

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Obama and his supporters brag about saving the US from the next Great Depression. In fact the recession ended roughly 9 months after Obama took office far too soon for his stimulus pork barrel spending to take effect.

Nonetheless Obama found a way to make the recovery the worst since the Great Depression by exploding the debt and with an open hostility towards any kind of fiscal management. In addition to record welfare costs, Obama promoted stagnant economic growth as the new normal.

Free market economies are in a constant state of change thanks to capital reallocation. As we have seen with Trump's rolling back regulations and welcoming businesses, government meddling in the economy is far more likely to make things worse than help. Obama expanded government control over businesses. Trump reduced it. The difference in results tells the story.
Yes he did. I think he truly believed that 1.5-2% GDP growth was all that was left in the USA. Kind of a defeatist attitude in my opinion. We never did see President Obama's education record. I'm guessing he didn't have much education in economics. President Trump has a degree in economics.
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Old 01-19-2018, 06:39 PM
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Default Re: The Dow just hit an all-time high, as the GOP tax plan fuels economic optimism

You mean to tell me a community organizer didn't produce a good economy?

Who woulda thought?!?!?!

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Old 01-19-2018, 08:51 PM
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Post Re: The Dow just hit an all-time high, as the GOP tax plan fuels economic optimism

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Obama didn't have ONE YEAR where the GDP was above 3% (First president to achieve that lackluster status)...
Check your facts...
For the entire year?
No.
Gross domestic product (GDP), the total value of goods and services produced in the U.S., never rose 3 percent annually under Obama, although there were eight separate quarters where GDP grew by more than 3 percent.
http://checkyourfact.com/2017/08/31/...3-under-obama/

So what's Trump's growth for his first year?
Hint: Not 3%.
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Old 01-19-2018, 08:57 PM
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Default Re: The Dow just hit an all-time high, as the GOP tax plan fuels economic optimism

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Old 01-19-2018, 10:55 PM
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Default Re: The Dow just hit an all-time high, as the GOP tax plan fuels economic optimism

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Originally Posted by foundit66 View Post
Check your facts...
For the entire year?
No.
Gross domestic product (GDP), the total value of goods and services produced in the U.S., never rose 3 percent annually under Obama, although there were eight separate quarters where GDP grew by more than 3 percent.
http://checkyourfact.com/2017/08/31/...3-under-obama/
I DID say "ONE YEAR"...I made zero claims about quarters...

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Originally Posted by foundit66 View Post
So what's Trump's growth for his first year?
Hint: Not 3%.
1st quarter 2017 - 0.7%
2nd quarter 2017 - 3.0%
3rd quarter 2017 - 3.2%
4th quarter 2017 - 3.98% expected; Numbers not in yet.
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Old 01-20-2018, 01:28 AM
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Default Re: The Dow just hit an all-time high, as the GOP tax plan fuels economic optimism

Market has been hitting all time highs for several years now. I'm glad the partisan right wing is finally taking notice, even if it because they think they can take credit.

Funny how Yall stooped claiming the unemployment numbers were fake once your guy was in charge tho.
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Old 01-22-2018, 06:45 AM
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Default Re: The Dow just hit an all-time high, as the GOP tax plan fuels economic optimism

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Market has been hitting all time highs for several years now. I'm glad the partisan right wing is finally taking notice, even if it because they think they can take credit.

Funny how Yall stooped claiming the unemployment numbers were fake once your guy was in charge tho.
And as I pointed out in another thread, the reasons for the growth in the stock market differ greatly between now and during Obama's admin. The gains now are due to consumer confidence and the rolling back of regulations and taxes that attached an anchor to businesses in this country.

During the Obama admin, the stock market rise was due mainly to Quantitative Easing (QE and QE2) where the Federal Reserve simply printed money and injected it into the market (bought up stock to keep companies afloat).

The funny thing is, the Democrats scream and cry the the Republicans are in the pockets of big business but it was the Democrats that implemented the policy that printed money and handed it to Wall Street. The Republicans are rolling back regulations and cutting taxes on EVERYONE and allowing the economy to grow on it's own. Who is in who's pocket here?
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