I agree.


I actually did think about the Cheneys on this issue.
There are varying levels of "support". Some "support" is (as I would phrase it) "absolute". Every opportunity that heterosexuals have is wanted and expected for their gay kid as well.
Other support is not as "absolute".
It would appear that Cheney has no problem with his daughter's child-raising future. I honestly don't know of any effort Cheney has that would be against gays raising kids, so that would be consistent.

I think you also mentioned give and take, and parents / gay kids need to learn that as well. While having a gay kid may not cause some parents to be model PFLAG parents, that doesn't mean that there is genuine love and support for the kid.

I already gave it.
You IGNORED it so you could lodge the following repetitive whine....



Noted, and ignored.
I DO argue the issue.
You have REPEATEDLY used this complaint to IGNORE topical comments.

And this case, that is PRECISELY what you are doing cause NONE of what I said there in your quote was "whining about style".

1) Your sentence doesn't make sense. If you want your sentence to continue to not make sense, ignore my comment on the fact that your point is not well stated.
That has nothing to do with "style" but rather being able to say something intelligible.
If it is your "style" to speak unintelligibly, please let me know...

2) "2) I DO NOT "take for granted"..."
That says NOTHING about your "style", but rather speaks to what I am ACTUALLY saying.
Predictably, you ignored that...

"3) You obviously don't have the bigger picture here.
It isn't a "children you raised" issue."
This is a directly topical point. It again has nothing to do with "style".


And I have no interest in your constant complaints about "style" while you avoid my points on topic.
Others can read and judge for themselves, so I don't know who you think you're fooling.
If you can't handle me commenting on both, that's your problem.

That has got to be one of the most absurd allegations I have seen.
Do you think teen boys wake up and say "I feel depressed. I'm attracted to girls, but maybe I should go have sex with another guy."

Especially considering how much homosexuality is ridiculed and attacked in our schools today, that's just ridiculous.


It's another indicator of teen treatment.
Obviously, parents have a big impact upon their child's life. You yourself should understand that as you have tried to portray all sorts of doom and disaster just cause a father is missing.

What impact do you think there would be if the father wasn't missing, but instead just explicitly hated "homosexuality" and the child knows that he is gay?

No it was a very general cite which did not say that all those runaways were engaged in homosexuality before they left home, or that the rejection of the parents were the reason. It does show how mentally unhealthy the gay lifestyle is and how it makes a harmful situation even more harmful.


I am not going to weed through your incessant attempts to debate style over substance.


In the context of yours perfect sense. And I have no time nor interest in your whining about style.


I assure you you can absolutely predict that if you are going to on and on about style the rest of your post will be ignored.


Then stick to the issues.

Go read your own cite which talked about runaways forming their own families on the street and getting into all sorts of unhealthful situations. Depression and mental instability can bring about all sorts of harmful behaviors.

As I recall you discounted the roles of mothers and fathers, anyone would do.

Yeah sorta like Obama did in his speech the other day.

If the father is a loving father as most are he would try to help his child understand the feelings he is having and to learn that such a lifestyle is harmful and he should try to seek to understand why he is having such feelings. But the loving parent would not turn the child out and most don't.

So back to the OP, why is it of particular note?

I re-affirm the absurdity of your attempts to interject unfounded conclusions into research articles that do not even hint at substantiating your ridiculous conjecture.
The whole idea that being homeless MAKES somebody gay is too foolish for words.
I would challenge you to substantiate your claims with relevant statistics breaking up kids according to "already gay" and "turned gay", but we both know you won't and can't.

Furthermore, considering the research which rejects your accusation of "mentally unhealthy gay lifestyle", it's obvious you're just running on uneducated prejudice and bigotry.


But yet, you will whine endlessly about it.
So in the end run, my arguments go unrefuted while all you do is whine about observations you don't even try to refute.


The funny part is that you make yourself into a liar.
Obviously, you DO address my posts and you do NOT ignore them.
In fact, the main thrust of your replies seems to be to repeatedly whine about any coincidental comment I make which could be possibly misrepresented into talking about "style".

As I pointed out, your original complaint over me talking about "style" was completely inaccurate.
You have thus made it a SELF-FULFILLING PROPHECY in that you inaccurately assess something, and then complain that any refutation of your claim is a "style" argument.

If you have no interest in talking about "style", then don't.
Just ignore it.
Otherwise, you're going to be spending a lot of time whining about me talking about something that you don't even bother to refute...

The easiest way to refute your b.s. is to just requote it for all the world to see what you want to ignore...

Numerous research studies conducted over the past decade find that gay, lesbian, bisexual, and transgender (GLBT) youth make up 25-40% of the homeless youth population in NYC and other large cities. One study found half of 432 homeless youth surveyed identified as gay, lesbian, or bisexual (Clatts, et al., 1996).

Gay, Lesbian, Bisexual and Transgender Youth


I discounted the importance of GENDER in making inseparable impacts.
That is a far way off from "discounting the *roles* of mothers and fathers".

It would be like pointing out that a Honda or a Chevy could get me to work. Which brand it is isn't important.
And then you come in and try to pretend I am discounting the brands themselves...


As I have repeatedly pointed out, but you dishonestly obfuscate, the important issue is NUMBER of parents.
Considering most parenting households are "mother-father", and the TYPICAL situation of a "missing-father" is NOT "two-mothers", it's obviously a non-comment on the other situations.
By your standards, if somebody pointed out the "missing-father" situation condemning the fathers, you would automatically assume that the person talking was criticizing fathers who happened to die from cancer for being absent...


If the father is a loving father, he would not interject his personal stereo-types and prejudices against the child.
Your "learn that such a lifestyle is harmful" is EXACTLY the type of crap I was talking about with regards to parents who do not kick the child out of the home, yet ostracize them nonetheless.

There is nothing inherently "harmful" about being gay.


If anybody else doesn't understand my point, I'll be happy to explain.
"Stinger" has shown he obviously has no interest in reading or understanding what I'm talking about, so I'm not going to waste time on repeating myself for him...

Yeah, Sting and Michael, Parents do disown their kids for coming out as gay. There used to be more people than now who disowned their kids cause they married an Oriental, a Black, a Spaniard.
I still remember the story of a local guy who caught his daughter "slipping around" with a black guy and shot them both dead, then was not even tried; there was no local coroner , only a police official and he was of the same mindset as the father and signed the death certificates as "accidental shooting".
The gay issue is much more emotional for some people than is reported in the news and of course the "shame" of the parent often prevents them from saying anything outside a tight group of family/friends.
This is also anecdotal, but I knew a guy back in the seventies whose father gave him money to stay away from the family including his own mother. He wouldn't take it and was disinherited. If he wanted to see his mom, they had to meet somewhere away from her home.
A guy I used to care for at the V.A. hospital in Houston, had his entire family drop him like a bad habit the minute they found out he had AIDS. That was his daughter who he had sent to an ivy league college, his son, and the man's siblings.
God bless you both for being so naive.

__________________


Give me Liberty! or give me marriage!

http://saltwn.blogspot.com/

I declare "bullshit"...

About the facts stated?...Nope...

About the JUMP that this percentage is due to preants having issues with their child's sexuality...

Nowhere does it say in the article that the REASON for this percentage is BECAUSE they're homosexual...In fact, I doubt the number is even half...

Consider the following...

1) Do parents of a heterosexual child throw their heterosexual child out because they consider their heterosexual child a "lazy bum" that sits in the basement listening to Iron maiden until 4AM and then spends the day playing XBox instead of "doing something with their life"?...

You betchya...

And there is NOTHING that would dissuade me from believing the exact same thing about parents of a homosexual child either...

2) Do parents of a heterosexual child throw their heterosexual child out because their heterosexual child has repeatedly used drugs and alcohol in and out of the home and their parents have lost hope that their heterosexual child can recover?

You betchya...

And there is NOTHING that would dissuade me from believing the exact same thing about parents of a homosexual child either...

3) Do parents of a heterosexual child throw their heterosexual child out because their heterosexual child is in a relationship with a person their parents disapprove of based on either narrowminded objections such as race, nationality, or how long their hair is or larger objections such as criminal record or longterm "bad influence"?...

You betchya...

And there is NOTHING that would dissuade me from believing the exact same thing about parents of a homosexual child either...

4) Could I think of a multitude of other reasons that are shared by both heterosexual children and homosexual children where "hetero-" and "homo" were not an issue?...

You betchya...

Now this point is VERY important...

5) How many of these homosexual homeless are on the streets by CHOICE?...

How many of them are using the very same "My parents just don't understand me!" excuse used by thousands of heterosexual runaways because they like their tattoos and piercings and music and lifestyle and felt living with their parents was too uncomfortable?...I'm absolutely SURE that many of these runaways had a secure home they could've stayed in but CHOSE to leave..I'm also sure that many parents have said "The door is always open" hoping for them to return one day.

25-40% of the homeless on the street are gay?...OK...

25-40% of the homeless are on the street BECAUSE they're gay?...

I don't think so...

__________________
"You get the respect that you give" - cnredd

First of all, we need to keep this in perspective.
The percentages are based on percentages of HOMELESS YOUTH.

Comparing that to ALL youths, including those that are not homeless, we're automatically reducing the percentage down rather significantly.
Most gay youths do not run away.

Second of all, obviously there are SOME expected "routine" reasons for running away for gay youth.
In a perfectly "average" world where gays are not over-represented, we would expect gay homeless population to be about 5%.

Third, there are other contributing factors. Some gay kids drop out of high school because of harassment, which could be another cause for a "run-away" situation.

Okay. Writing this before I get to your objections, let's see if we have any overlap...


All of the above would essentially set up a situation where the percentage of homeless gay youths is exactly the same as the percentage of gay youths in our society.
About 5%.
Ergo, the other "20-35%" still needs to be covered...


Quite frankly, in a lot of ways I see this as an extension of the above 1-4, but I listed it separately because of potential additional connotations.
Based on personal experience and life stories from gay people I know, I don't find this as anywhere near significant.

I personally don't know any gay people who were homeless as youth.
But I do know a couple gay people who would be cut out of the family if they came out.
I do know one gay person whose brother came out, and his father attacked him.
I know some gay people whose partners are not welcome at "family" events.
And these are just the stories I know.

Considering all the crap that is out there that gays have to go through, I just don't see how some "discomfort" would be significant enough for gays to cause them to just run-away without any parental "coercion".
It would be like jumping away from a monkey when King Kong is standing behind you...