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Civil Rights & Abortion Discuss Homosexuality is to blame for sexual abuse, not Catholic church, claims German cardin at the Political Forums; "“What has happened in the church is no different from what is happening in society as a whole,” Cardinal Walter ...

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Old 01-05-2019, 12:34 PM
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Default Homosexuality is to blame for sexual abuse, not Catholic church, claims German cardin

"“What has happened in the church is no different from what is happening in society as a whole,” Cardinal Walter Brandmüller said. “The real scandal is that the Catholic church hasn’t distinguished itself from the rest of society.”

A study commissioned by the German Bishops Conference and published last year found that more than 3,600 children were sexually abused by Catholic clergy in Germany between 1946 and 2014.

But Cardinal Brandmüller claimed that only a “vanishingly small number” of clergy had committed abuses. He said the real problem was homosexuality and claimed it is “statistically proven” that there is a link between homosexuality and abuse.

Society “forgets or covers up the fact that 80 per cent of cases of sexual assault in the church involved male youths not children,” he told Germany’s DPA news agency in an interview a few days ahead of his 90th birthday."
More at https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/201...church-claims/
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Old 01-05-2019, 01:03 PM
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Default Re: Homosexuality is to blame for sexual abuse, not Catholic church, claims German ca

Homosexuality and pedophilia are two separate persuasions. Homosexuality doesn't cause pedophilia. One person's insistence that the real problem was homosexuality and claim that it is “statistically proven” that there is a link between homosexuality and abuse is proof of nothing.

Perhaps the Catholic Church's asinine insistence on celibacy for priests is the root cause of sexual abuse by those priests.
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Old 01-05-2019, 04:05 PM
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Default Re: Homosexuality is to blame for sexual abuse, not Catholic church, claims German ca

pedophiles are drawn to jobs and relationships that put them in close contact with children.
latent unaccepted homosexuality may be a factor, but a healthy homosexual status and acceptance is no more apt to make one a pedophile than a heterosexual status. skin color, religion are also not factors
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Old 01-05-2019, 04:55 PM
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Default Re: Homosexuality is to blame for sexual abuse, not Catholic church, claims German ca

Seems like the Cardinal is using this as of a dodge/cover to lessen the irresponsibility and horror show of the ongoing Church Scandal.
.... but... that doesn't mean that there's not some small bit of truth to the comment. Not the whole story but some reality none the less.

Here's an article that refers to homosexual activist admitting similar to the cardinals statement.

Quote:
Conservative gay activist Milo Yiannopoulos is surrounded by controversy yet again, first because he was invited by the conservative giant CPAC to keynote their next conference, then because he was dropped after critics posted several audio clips in which he apparently endorsed pedophilia, and now because of his statement strongly denouncing pedophilia, speaking as a child abuse victim himself. What are we to make of all this?
First, it was an error for CPAC to invite Milo to keynote, despite his rhetorical brilliance and his ability to dismantle and expose today’s ridiculous PC extremes....
...Second, while denouncing pedophilia (which is something every gay man I have ever talked to about this has done, without equivocation), Milo drew attention to the fact that many older gay men are involved with much younger gay men (commonly called “boys,” according to Milo), a practice defended in 2013 by the influential gay journalist Michelangelo Signorile, who noted that, “Historically, gay men have engaged in intergenerational sexual encounters, brief romances and long-term relationships — among consenting adults — probably much more than straight people have.”
And although Milo alleges that these aforementioned “boys” are all of the age of consent, it is no secret that gay activists have often been at the forefront of pushing for the lowering of the age of consent. (For a 2010 example from England, see here.) It is also no secret that gay literature through the centuries has celebrated the “love” of grown men and boys, and in these cases, there is no doubt that they were minors rather than young men.

As I demonstrated in painstaking detail in A Queer Thing Happened to America, the identical arguments that have been used by gay activists to defend homosexuality have also been used by advocates of so-called “man-boy love” (or, in its sanitized form, “intergenerational intimacy”).
The 8 principle arguments I listed were:
Pedophilia is innate and immutable. (This is increasingly accepted by scientists, who now call for sympathy for the pedophile’s struggles, while continuing to denounce their actions. It is also becoming more common to classify pedophilia as a sexual orientation.)
Pederasty is richly attested in many different cultures throughout history.
The claim that adult-child sexual relationships cause harm is greatly overstated and often completely inaccurate.
Consensual adult-child sex can actually be beneficial to the child.
Pederasty should not be classified as a mental disorder, since it does not cause distress to the pederast to have these desires and since the pederast can function as a normal, contributing member of society.
Many of the illustrious homosexuals of the past were actually pedophiles.
People are against intergenerational intimacy because of antiquated social standards and puritanical sexual phobias.
This is all about love and equality and liberation.

As I noted in 2011, “none of these arguments should surprise us. After all, the age of increasing sexual anarchy in which we live is a fruit of the sexual revolution of the 1960’s, and the seeds of sexual anarchy were sown already by Alfred Kinsey in the late 1940’s, as Prof. Judith Reisman has tirelessly documented. And it was Kinsey, after all, who relied on the research of pedophiles to document the sexual responses of infants and children.”
To repeat: Every gay man who has ever commented to me about pedophilia seemed as repulsed as I was to the thought of an adult sexually abusing a child, and I’m absolutely not equating homosexuality with pedophilia.
But I am saying that, whereas most heterosexual teens who lose their virginity do so with their peers (schoolmates and the like, perhaps just a few years older than them), there is a disproportionate amount of intergenerational sex among homosexuals, often involving older men and boys (by which I do mean boys).
In the aftermath of the arrest of child abuser Jerry Sandusky, I noted that the acclaimed gay journalist Randy Shilts stated that “at age 11, [gay icon Harvey] Milk began attending performances of the New York Metropolitan Opera where he met with ‘wandering hands’ and soon was engaged in ‘brief trysts [with grown men] after the performances.’ While still in junior high, he ‘dove headfirst into the newly discovered subculture,’ and by the age of 14, Milk was ‘leading an active homosexual life.’”
This led to the obvious question: Were the men who were sexually involved with Harvey Milk much better than Jerry Sandusky? And can an 11-year-old give truly informed consent to such acts?
Shilts also wrote that as Milk grew older, the pattern reversed itself to the point that, at age 33, he hooked up with a 16-year-old named Jack McKinley, one of a number of younger men with whom he was intimate. How common was Milk’s experience among gay men?
I suggest that Milo has provided a window into a disturbing aspect of gay culture, one in which gay men do not abduct children and abuse them but one in which they do engage in sexual and romantic relationships with minors – unless we are actually to believe that when gay men speak about having sex with “boys,” they mean, “but only those who are consenting adults!”

I think not.

https://askdrbrown.org/library/milo-...and-pedophilia
when it was reported that Judge Roy Moore in Alabama as an adult Lawyer was walking the malls looking for high school (or younger?) girls. He was correctly condemned for the behavior. I don't know that he was accused of any younger than that but that's sad enough.
"the prophet" Mohamed is cited as marrying an 11 year old and he's rightly condemned for that by most as well. As well as some Muslim practices of forced marriages of young girls.

there's no double standard on my part here, it's wrong either way.
But it seems that in the heterosexual community liking far younger teen and pre-teen girls is not a major leaning. While ...as noted in the article, it's candidly admitted by some male homosexual activist that.... the homosexual community does have a significant contingent that has this preference for "boys", as Milo Y put it.

Discounting it as a factor doesn't help deal with the sexual abuses in the Church or elsewhere.
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Old 01-05-2019, 05:20 PM
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Default Re: Homosexuality is to blame for sexual abuse, not Catholic church, claims German ca

Quote:
Originally Posted by mr wonder View Post
Seems like the Cardinal is using this as of a dodge/cover to lessen the irresponsibility and horror show of the ongoing Church Scandal.
.... but... that doesn't mean that there's not some small bit of truth to the comment. Not the whole story but some reality none the less.

Here's an article that refers to homosexual activist admitting similar to the cardinals statement.



when it was reported that Judge Roy Moore in Alabama as an adult Lawyer was walking the malls looking for high school (or younger?) girls. He was correctly condemned for the behavior. I don't know that he was accused of any younger than that but that's sad enough.
"the prophet" Mohamed is cited as marrying an 11 year old and he's rightly condemned for that by most as well. As well as some Muslim practices of forced marriages of young girls.

there's no double standard on my part here, it's wrong either way.
But it seems that in the heterosexual community liking far younger teen and pre-teen girls is not a major leaning. While ...as noted in the article, it's candidly admitted by some male homosexual activist that.... the homosexual community does have a significant contingent that has this preference for "boys", as Milo Y put it.

Discounting it as a factor doesn't help deal with the sexual abuses in the Church or elsewhere.
I am sorry but you just cannot use Milo as a reference for statistics or allegories as truth.
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Old 01-05-2019, 09:03 PM
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Default Re: Homosexuality is to blame for sexual abuse, not Catholic church, claims German ca

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I am sorry but you just cannot use Milo as a reference for statistics or allegories as truth.
why not Milo, if his facts are correct? (if it is raining and a Joe Stalin says it raining it doesn't make it untrue)
And the rest is not allegory it's personal histories.
Seems Harvey Milk was surrounded by pedophiles who were homosexual from the time he was 11 years old through out his teens.
The other homosexuals in the piece suggest that this is not something folks should think of as uncommon.

The situation in the Roman Catholic church certainly doesn't make the opposite case.
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Old 01-05-2019, 10:42 PM
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Default Re: Homosexuality is to blame for sexual abuse, not Catholic church, claims German ca

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Seems Harvey Milk was surrounded by pedophiles who were homosexual from the time he was 11 years old through out his teens.
Yes, and in liu of that timeframe it is well documented that the gay pride movement well into the 80s allowed NAMBLA in their marches. (They don't like to admit that now.) Most of the cases in the RCC involve adolescents--the correct term should be pederasty (as Milo correctly points out). Their movement uses the term 'pedophilia' as the catch-all term because that term more easily portrays these cases as having nothing to do with the priests being gay.
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Old 01-07-2019, 08:11 PM
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Post Re: Homosexuality is to blame for sexual abuse, not Catholic church, claims German ca

Quote:
Originally Posted by mr wonder View Post
why not Milo, if his facts are correct? (if it is raining and a Joe Stalin says it raining it doesn't make it untrue)
And the rest is not allegory it's personal histories.
Seems Harvey Milk was surrounded by pedophiles who were homosexual from the time he was 11 years old through out his teens.
The other homosexuals in the piece suggest that this is not something folks should think of as uncommon.
Milo presents no real "facts" in the first place.

You bold-faced the following, which I will requote and point out what is blatantly stated:
Milo drew attention to the fact that many older gay men are involved with much younger gay men (commonly called “boys,” according to Milo), a practice defended in 2013 by the influential gay journalist Michelangelo Signorile, who noted that, “Historically, gay men have engaged in intergenerational sexual encounters, brief romances and long-term relationships — among consenting adults — probably much more than straight people have.
See the fact that they specified gay MEN and "consenting ADULTS"?
It is mindless to try to pretend this is somehow relevant for pedophilia. It would be like saying that a straight man's reference to a woman as a "chick" somehow demonstrates pedophilia/beastiality.


Quote:
Originally Posted by mr wonder View Post
As I demonstrated in painstaking detail in A Queer Thing Happened to America...

The "similarities" noted are irrelevant.
The fact that homosexuality is immutable / innate was not instrumental in achieving equal rights. It's the anti-gay bigots who mindlessly claim it is a "choice", thus people counter with the facts.
"different cultures throughout history" => you can make the same argument about murder, adultery, theft, ...
"adult-child sexual relationships cause harm is greatly overstated" => It's harm is documented. Anybody claiming otherwise is deluding themselves. Quite frankly, I am of the mindset that any child molester making this claim should be put in a room with their now adult child molestation victim. The victim is given access to pipe wrenches, etc, etc, etc. Let the victim decide a reciprocal response for their "over-stated" harm.
"Pederasty should not be classified as a mental disorder, since it does not cause distress to the pederast to have these desires..." => This is like a pyromaniac or kleptomaniac not feeling "distress" over their disorder. SOME having a lack of distress is not as relevant as their actions causing serious harm to others. And overall, this idea is irrelevant as whether or not pedophilia is recognized as a mental disorder is completely irrelevant compared to whether or not child molestation should be illegal. People steal all the time who are not kleptomaniacs, but it's still illegal.

The last three are completely specious and meaningless to the actual issue at hand. These are not intelligible reasons for why pedophilia should / should not be a mental disorder. Not intelligible reasons for why child molestation should / should not be illegal.

As for Reisman, she is a nutjob in her own right and I believe I have explained that to you in the past.


Quote:
Originally Posted by mr wonder View Post
The situation in the Roman Catholic church certainly doesn't make the opposite case.
How?
Because kids got molested, that proves what exactly?

Studies have shown that the relative frequency of child molestation is the same between the Catholic church and other professions. The Catholic church is not guilty of committing more molestations (statistically speaking, per capita) than other areas.

So how does the Roman Catholic church supposedly make "the opposite case"?
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Old 01-07-2019, 08:22 PM
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Post Re: Homosexuality is to blame for sexual abuse, not Catholic church, claims German ca

mr wonder, you should really take a look at Milo Y before trying to claim that one man's statements somehow provide an expose into all of homosexuality.
By that mindset, if I find a Christian who is critical of Christianity, that would prove as a generalizing / stereotyping "exposure" of truth, right?


Milo Y actually has a bad history on the subject. He is actually supportive of pedophilia / pederasty (however you want to put it).
His statements would be better understood as a man who wants pedophilia / pederasty to be legalized, ergo he tries to justify it by such statements as you provided...
Breitbart News editor Milo Yiannopoulos says sex between adult men and 13 year-old boys is OK as long as the boy’s sexual organs are “mature.” He would also like to thank a certain Catholic priest for teaching him to “give such good head” when Yiannopoulos was a child.
https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry...b029c1d1f88d77

Here's an example showing Milo himself push pedophilia.

Milo is a man with a lot of issues. It looks like he was molested and instead of dealing with that pain and healing, he has chosen to embrace it.
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Old 01-07-2019, 08:32 PM
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Default Re: Homosexuality is to blame for sexual abuse, not Catholic church, claims German ca

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Homosexuality is to blame for sexual abuse, not Catholic church, claims German cardinal
This is nothing but an attempt to obfuscate the issue and create a scape-goat.

As I pointed out, the frequency of child molestation in the Catholic church is not greater than the rest of society. It's not truly a problem with "more" kids being molested, but how the church reacts to the molestation crime.

The Catholic hierarchy has a long history of covering up the crimes.
Paying off the victim, hiding the rapist from exposure and sending the molesting priest off to a new parish with fresh victims.
THAT is the real problem.

Just imagine if some other organization did something like this. Imagine if a teacher's group recognized teacher's raping kids in their group, paid off the victims and then moved the rapist to a new school district.
The organization would be brought down HARD.
But the Catholic church has its relative size and also the fact that it's "religion" on their side, so this aspect often gets ignored in the bigger picture.
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