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Civil Rights & Abortion Discuss MP: use anti-terror powers on Christian teachers who say gay marriage is ‘wrong’ at the Political Forums; from the "it will never happen" and "it will need happen here" files MP: use anti-terror powers on Christian teachers ...

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Old 08-06-2015, 10:15 AM
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Default MP: use anti-terror powers on Christian teachers who say gay marriage is ‘wrong’

from the "it will never happen" and "it will need happen here" files

MP: use anti-terror powers on Christian teachers who say gay marriage is ‘wrong’

Quote:
New banning orders intended to clamp down on hate preachers and terrorist propagandists should be used against Christian teachers who teach children that gay marriage is “wrong”, a Tory MP has argued.

Mark Spencer called for those who use their position in the classroom to teach traditionalist views on marriage to be subject to “Extremism Disruption Orders” (EDOs), tough new restrictions planned by David Cameron and Theresa May to curb radicalisation by jihadists.

In a letter to a constituent, Mr Spencer, the MP for Sherwood in Nottinghamshire, insisted that Christian teachers were still “perfectly entitled” to express their views on same-sex marriage – but only “in some situations”.

Christian campaigners said Mr Spencer’s remarks confirmed what they had previously warned: that those who believe marriage should only be between a man and a woman would now be “branded extremists”.

The National Secular Society, which supports same-sex marriage, said the proposed banning orders could be one of the biggest threats to freedom of expression ever seen in the UK.

David Cameron outlined the counter-extremism plans after the General Election

Ministers have signalled that the orders, expected to be a key plank of the Government planned new Counter-Extremism Bill, would be used not only curb the activities of radical Islamist clerics but those who promote other views deemed to go against “British values”.

Ministers have defined British values in the past as including broad notions like democracy, tolerance and the rule of law....
MP: use anti-terror powers on Christian teachers who say gay marriage is ‘wrong’ - Telegraph
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Old 08-06-2015, 11:00 AM
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Post Re: MP: use anti-terror powers on Christian teachers who say gay marriage is ‘wrong’

This INDIVIDUAL's comments need to be slapped down as violations of civil rights.

But let's not pretend this is an actual problem regarding what ONE person is giving for his opinion.
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Old 08-06-2015, 11:09 AM
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Default Re: MP: use anti-terror powers on Christian teachers who say gay marriage is ‘wrong’

Quote:
Originally Posted by foundit66 View Post
This INDIVIDUAL's comments need to be slapped down as violations of civil rights.
But let's not pretend this is an actual problem regarding what ONE person is giving for his opinion.



of course of course...
it's only one person... just an elected official... represpesenting some number of constituents.... sitting in a law making body of a country... from a major party...

tut tut it's should not even be MENTIONED... as even a real concern.
much less an "ACUTAL PROBLEM"?

no ever really compares Christians with Muslims terrorist or crazy people... so yeah...


sheesh
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Old 08-06-2015, 11:25 AM
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Default Re: MP: use anti-terror powers on Christian teachers who say gay marriage is ‘wrong’

Quote:
Originally Posted by mr. wonder View Post

of course of course...
it's only one person... just an elected official... represpesenting some number of constituents.... sitting in a law making body of a country... from a major party...

tut tut it's should not even be MENTIONED... as even a real concern.
much less an "ACUTAL PROBLEM"?
I understand and agree with posting it and saying "This guy is just plain wrong!".

I profoundly disagree with any pretense that it should be used to indicate any form of wider spread problem than it actually is.
ONE GUY is ONE GUY no matter how often you count him.
Doesn't matter if he's part of an organization or not. Does NOT mean his opinion suddenly is shared by more people just because he's part of an organization.


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Originally Posted by mr. wonder View Post
no ever really compares Christians with Muslims terrorist or crazy people... so yeah...
sheesh
Apples and oranges.
The people who make such comparisons ARE NOT ASKING for "anti-terror powers" to be applied to Christians to deprive them of free speech.

You have a serious problem with admitting what individual people are saying and what GROUPS AS A WHOLE are NOT saying.
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Old 08-06-2015, 11:29 AM
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Default Re: MP: use anti-terror powers on Christian teachers who say gay marriage is ‘wrong’

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Originally Posted by mr. wonder View Post
from the "it will never happen" and "it will need happen here" files

MP: use anti-terror powers on Christian teachers who say gay marriage is ‘wrong’



MP: use anti-terror powers on Christian teachers who say gay marriage is ‘wrong’ - Telegraph
If this is a privately funded christian school then I don't see why they would silence her, on the other hand a public school teacher should not have said this in class. I wouldn't want a Muslim teacher telling my kids or grans that women should not drive and Christians were a bunch of heathens, in fact I would want him fired.
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Old 08-06-2015, 12:02 PM
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Default Re: MP: use anti-terror powers on Christian teachers who say gay marriage is ‘wrong’

Quote:
Originally Posted by foundit66 View Post
...
You have a serious problem with admitting what individual people are saying and what GROUPS AS A WHOLE are NOT saying.


look Foundit66.
You should probably stop using that line as a defense.
Unless you go about correcting everyone who post something about what Ted Cruz says, or Sarah Palin, or Pat Robertson, or Romney, or Limbaugh, Donald Trump or fill in the blank Republican or Christian... the same goes with quotes from Hillary, Bill, Pelosi, Chuck Schumer Obama, ... etc etc.
they are ONLY ONE PERSON --sheesh- get real.

these people are politicians they have influences and followers.
it's disingenuous to pretend that it's "just one person" therefore it shouldn't be seriously considered beyond ..your... comfort zone. ridiculous.
to try and dismiss the attempt to criminalize comments on homosexual marriage is a BIG DEAL when you're ONE member of Parliament in major party.

Among other things it obviously means he thinks the idea will NOT COST him politically.

If Ted Cruz tried to make speaking against becoming a christian in school by homosexual teachers apart of an anti-terrorism bill I suspect your reply wouldn't be so dismissive. (" bad but... it's just one man") And others on the left would have more than a few pages of digital ink and commentary on the proposal.

be realistic and don't use the knee jerk play down the comment anyway possible card. it's a poor defense..

the proposal is a VERY SERIOUS commentary on a MEMBER OF PARLIAMENT's views on free speech of specifically Christians.
the fact is i'm sure he's not "alone" even salt seems to agree in principal, he doesn't have to be speaking for "everyone", ridiculous.
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Old 08-06-2015, 04:29 PM
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Post Re: MP: use anti-terror powers on Christian teachers who say gay marriage is ‘wrong’

Quote:
Originally Posted by mr. wonder View Post
look Foundit66.
You should probably stop using that line as a defense.
Unless you go about correcting everyone who post something about what Ted Cruz says, or Sarah Palin, or Pat Robertson, or Romney, or Limbaugh, Donald Trump or fill in the blank Republican or Christian... the same goes with quotes from Hillary, Bill, Pelosi, Chuck Schumer Obama, ... etc etc.
they are ONLY ONE PERSON --sheesh- get real.
Mountains and Molehills.

If you show me an elected official within the group saying something, that will be one thing.
If you show me a person with an actual massive following in the group, that will be something similar.

Habitually you show individuals within the group saying something, and even when I quote the group (e.g. APA) repudiating that individual, you claim it's still representative of the group.

Even then, your examples are crap.
I don't claim Palin is representative of Republicans.
Pat Robertson is representative of the people who follow him, but not all or most Christians.
Hell. I've pointed out on MULTIPLE occasions that Romney had serious problems with many in the Republican party not following him because he wasn't extreme enough.

Do NOT try to pretend hypocrisy on this cause you don't have a leg to stand on.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mr. wonder View Post
these people are politicians they have influences and followers.
So you say.
If that's the truth, it should be easy for you to document how many people follow this standard presented...

Habitually you show an individual, and assume (even sometimes despite contradicting evidence) that either there is broad-field acceptance / support or that it will be in place in the future.

The problem is you never prove it.


Quote:
Originally Posted by mr. wonder View Post
Among other things it obviously means he thinks the idea will NOT COST him politically.

Some people are too stupid and/or extreme to care.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mr. wonder View Post
If Ted Cruz tried to make speaking against becoming a christian in school by homosexual teachers apart of an anti-terrorism bill I suspect your reply wouldn't be so dismissive.
I would talk about what he is saying, but I would not assume other Christians shared his beliefs without documenting it.

And THAT is habitually where your presentations fall apart.
You REFUSE to think you have any burden to document the wider spread support. You show one example, and assume it's significant to the group.

If you google him, he says all sorts of idiocy the party obviously doesn't support.
'Patronising' Tory MP Mark Spencer Accused Of Wanting The Poor To Starve In The Dark
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Old 08-06-2015, 05:22 PM
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Default Re: MP: use anti-terror powers on Christian teachers who say gay marriage is ‘wrong’

Quote:
Originally Posted by foundit66 View Post
Mountains and Molehills.
If you show me an elected official within the group saying something, that will be one thing.
If you show me a person with an actual massive following in the group, that will be something similar.

Habitually you show individuals within the group saying something, and even when I quote the group (e.g. APA) repudiating that individual, you claim it's still representative of the group.

Even then, your examples are crap.
I don't claim Palin is representative of Republicans.
Pat Robertson is representative of the people who follow him, but not all or most Christians.
Hell. I've pointed out on MULTIPLE occasions that Romney had serious problems with many in the Republican party not following him because he wasn't extreme enough.

Do NOT try to pretend hypocrisy on this cause you don't have a leg to stand on.
well ok
Just QUOTE ME in this thread where I denied the MP had any opposition and claimed the MP represented ALL of Parliament, ALL of England, ALL of his Party, ALL of his constituents, or ALL of ANY GROUP..
then i'll concede the point.

if not then... well i suppose you've somehow misread my post.
no worries.
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Old 08-06-2015, 05:55 PM
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Post Re: MP: use anti-terror powers on Christian teachers who say gay marriage is ‘wrong’

Quote:
Originally Posted by mr. wonder View Post
well ok
Just QUOTE ME in this thread where I denied the MP had any opposition and claimed the MP represented ALL of Parliament, ALL of England, ALL of his Party, ALL of his constituents, or ALL of ANY GROUP..
then i'll concede the point.
How about you admit that he was one guy doing it, then I'll concede the point.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mr. wonder View Post
if not then... well i suppose you've somehow misread my post.
no worries.
B.S.

I never claimed you said all.

To repeat myself:
I profoundly disagree with any pretense that it should be used to indicate any form of wider spread problem than it actually is.
ONE GUY is ONE GUY no matter how often you count him.
Doesn't matter if he's part of an organization or not. Does NOT mean his opinion suddenly is shared by more people just because he's part of an organization.
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Old 08-06-2015, 06:09 PM
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Default Re: MP: use anti-terror powers on Christian teachers who say gay marriage is ‘wrong’

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Originally Posted by foundit66 View Post
...I never claimed you said all....
no problem
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