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Civil Rights & Abortion Discuss Judge Blocks California Ban On Gay Conversion Therapy at the Political Forums; A federal judge on Monday temporarily blocked California's ban on therapy that aims to convert minors from gay to straight, ...

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Old 12-04-2012, 10:56 AM
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Default Judge Blocks California Ban On Gay Conversion Therapy

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A federal judge on Monday temporarily blocked California's ban on therapy that aims to convert minors from gay to straight, the LA Times reports:

U.S. District Judge William Shubb ruled that the new law, SB 1172, signed by Gov. Jerry Brown earlier this year, may inhibit the 1st Amendment rights of therapists who oppose homosexuality. The judge signed a temporary injunction that prohibits the state from enforcing the ban, the first of its kind in the nation, against the three plaintiffs in the suit pending trial.
Judge Blocks California Ban On Gay Conversion Therapy | TPM LiveWire
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Old 12-04-2012, 11:17 AM
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Default Re: Judge Blocks California Ban On Gay Conversion Therapy

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may inhibit the 1st Amendment rights of therapists who oppose homosexuality.
How has their right to oppose homosexuality been inhibited?

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Old 12-04-2012, 11:24 AM
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Default Re: Judge Blocks California Ban On Gay Conversion Therapy

and in other news ...judge blocks desegregation order citing constitutional rights of school administrators to expand personal bigotry to public institutions...
no wait
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Old 12-04-2012, 11:28 AM
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Default Re: Judge Blocks California Ban On Gay Conversion Therapy

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Originally Posted by sadisticpixie View Post
How has their right to oppose homosexuality been inhibited?

The first amendment gives us freedom of speech and freedom of religion. This law basically says......."Under penalty of law, as a therapist you may not say 'this' about your religion".

On the one hand, that violates speech and religious freedoms.

On the other hand, not all speech and things done in the name of religion are protected.

On the third hand, this law only applied to therapy directed at minors. Under the law, minors are not generally granted the right or ability to act in their own best interests.



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Old 12-04-2012, 11:50 AM
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Default Re: Judge Blocks California Ban On Gay Conversion Therapy

Not having a written decision before me, I can't really speak to the full rationale of the judge.

Per the article, there is a TEMPORARY injunction that prevents the state from enforcing the law. A TEMPORARY injunction is a fairly standard remedy when someone claims an infringement of a right. This will allow the law to go through judicial review to determine if there actually is a legitimate argument.

So this, by no means, should be assumed to be "blocking" the legislation or "overturning" the legislation, as it is a temporary injunction to allow the review of the issue.

Many of the questions asked get to the merits of the case by those who would seek to continue conversion therapy. Those questions will be resolved when this goes to court on the merits.

On the question of the merits, I'm not sure there is a strong case supporting a first amendment violation. It would seem to be that there would be no actual violation of speech, one can say what they want. This is, to my mind, a question of activity outside the protections of the first amendment.
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Old 12-04-2012, 11:52 AM
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Default Re: Judge Blocks California Ban On Gay Conversion Therapy

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Originally Posted by catusfelidae View Post
The first amendment gives us freedom of speech and freedom of religion. This law basically says......."Under penalty of law, as a therapist you may not say 'this' about your religion".

On the one hand, that violates speech and religious freedoms.

On the other hand, not all speech and things done in the name of religion are protected.

On the third hand, this law only applied to therapy directed at minors. Under the law, minors are not generally granted the right or ability to act in their own best interests.



You see, this is why human beings can't have rights. Might not be as fair, but it would be a hell of a lot easier to run a country under a dictatorship.
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Old 12-04-2012, 12:57 PM
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Default Re: Judge Blocks California Ban On Gay Conversion Therapy

"Mom, Dad. I keep having homosexual thoughts, but I don't want to be a homosexual. Can you get me help with this?" "Sorry, sweetie, but we live in California and we're not allowed to do that." "OK, I'll just be upstairs with a razor blade and my own personal pain. Maybe I'll come down later... or maybe not..."
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Old 12-04-2012, 12:58 PM
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Default Re: Judge Blocks California Ban On Gay Conversion Therapy

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Originally Posted by Awahso View Post
You see, this is why human beings can't have rights. Might not be as fair, but it would be a hell of a lot easier to run a country under a dictatorship.
Sounds good to me. As long as *I* am the dictator.
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Old 12-04-2012, 01:45 PM
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Default Re: Judge Blocks California Ban On Gay Conversion Therapy

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Originally Posted by faithful_servant View Post
"Mom, Dad. I keep having homosexual thoughts, but I don't want to be a homosexual. Can you get me help with this?" "Sorry, sweetie, but we live in California and we're not allowed to do that." "OK, I'll just be upstairs with a razor blade and my own personal pain. Maybe I'll come down later... or maybe not..."
The kid needs therapy, but conversion therapy is not the answer. The kid can still get therapy...
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Old 12-04-2012, 01:53 PM
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Default Re: Judge Blocks California Ban On Gay Conversion Therapy

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Originally Posted by dabateman View Post
The kid needs therapy, but conversion therapy is not the answer. The kid can still get therapy...
But if that's what he/she wants, why should anyone stop him/her from getting it?? What happened to that good old fashioned liberal ideal of freedom of choice? If a kid has homosexual urges or has acted out in homosexual ways and wants to stop, why should the State of California prevent him/her from doing so?? It's about the kids wishes and nothing else. This shouldn't be a referendum on homosexuality, but on the kid's freedom to choose their path in life. If this was a ban on counseling kids who want to explore thier homosexual feelings, you'd be screaming bloody murder. This is no different. It's stopping the kid from getting the help they want to move towards being the person they want to be in a healthy manner.
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