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Originally Posted by Kizzume
THOSE are the things I think organizations like GLAAD should be focusing on. Unfortunately, they’re not going to, especially the multiple sex partner thing because it will offend so many gay people to say that out in the open.
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I can sort of see where you're coming from.
But at the same time, I see no reason why gays should have to put themselves through rougher standards than straights do.
If a wife doesn't care if her husband cheats on business trips, that doesn't matter to their legal status. So why should it to gays, if it's actually openly stated in the relationship?
Straights have steadily and routinely gutted "marriage" and "divorce" from having any personal responsibility with misconduct. Adultery doesn't matter to "no fault divorce" states.
It's like if you had a black applicant for a job, and he satisfied all the regular sections, but then you had him take a diction test to see if he talked well enough...
Meanwhile, the previous applicant has a Southern drawl so thick that it's difficult to comprehend, and nobody thinks twice.
I personally think that it was wrong to make marriage into a couple joke where the circumstances of divorce don't matter. I would prefer it to be more solidified for monogamy against adultery.
But the straights have been lowering their standards all this time, and now gays have to meet higher standards before they are let in the club?
Fundamentally, there is something wrong with that.
Although
logistically, I see a point to your comment.
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Originally Posted by Kizzume
I have been the bad guy many times when it comes to the subject of gay liberation. I was kicked out of Act Up for stating that I think that if we’re to try to give people the message that we’re like everyone else that wearing a pink tu-tu with boas when protesting is a bad idea and that we should dress like we were at the meeting—of course they said “But that’s who we are!” and I said “We’re in a meeting of supposedly like-minded people, in a safe place, we’re being ourselves, yet I don’t see you dressed that way now.” “You’re just a bigot! Bigot Bigot bigot!” and they all chanted “bigot” and almost shoved me down a flight of stairs.
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I went to gay pride this year, in San Fran.
MOST of it was kosher (except for the
gay
) thing.
But those guys who were walking around inappropriately undressed? They still annoy the hell out of me.
Those that walk around like it's Halloween? They annoy the hell out of me too.
Have you ever seen Bravo's "Rick & Steve"? They had a gay pride episode that touched on the gay extremists being exclusionary. You might get a kick out of it.
I think to do some of what ACT-Up did early on...
They NEEDED to be revolutionary.
But it's a pity that they didn't recognize your help for
being help, even if they disagreed with other things like style.
When the
first (1960's era) gay protestors went out to protest, they MADE A POINT of showing people that they were just like everybody else. The only way you would have known that the guy in the suit was gay was cause he was carrying a sign saying "I am gay and deserve equal rights". It made a point.
Today's crowd can lose that point.
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Originally Posted by Kizzume
I went to a gay pride planning meeting...
“You’re just a bigot! Bigot!” and received EXACTLY the same treatment I got at the Act Up meeting.
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ROFLMAO!
You're a bigot who has done more volunteering for gays than a LOT of gays...
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Originally Posted by Kizzume
In, I think it was 1993, there was an anti-gay measure that was the Washington equivalent of Measure 9 in Oregon ....
How disconnected from reality can they be?
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Redacted only for brevity of this post. I recommend people go back and read Kizzume's original.
To answer your question.
VERY.
I can't help but think of Harvey Milk. He took on the anti-gay teacher's measure in California in much the same way you did.
The other way
would not have gotten results.
Quite frankly, the dishonesty of the anti-gay side annoys me. And the people that disrupted your point
fail to recognize how they play into the anti-gay side's approach.
For example, if you use the word "bigot", then suddenly the argument is endlessly distracted by the people who are opposing gay adoption / gay employment protection / gay civil unions by their endless complaints about how they don't want to be called bigots. (And in some cases, it's not an accurate label IMO)
The anti-gay side paint themselves as the victim, instead of the fact that they want to stop equality being the issue.
P Hilton is an excellent example of somebody who played into the anti-gay hands. ONE idiot blogger mouths off, and suddenly the "anti-gay marriage" movement spends THOUSANDS AND THOUSANDS of dollars talking about how awful it is that gays bash them.
When most gays wanted P Hilton to STFU up!
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Originally Posted by Kizzume
Part of the concept of a “melting pot” is that there is a bit of homogenization. As some people claim some of the things from other cultures, those cultures claim some of the things from those people. There’s a tradeoff. And it often seems that in the gay community, there isn’t a willingness to have that tradeoff.
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Seriously.
Rick & Steve. Gay Pride episode. "Swallowing Pride"
Rick & Steve: Swallowing Pride > Overview - AllMovie
If you get a chance, please see it. I think you'll love it.
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Originally Posted by Kizzume
I can understand why some people are so actually violently against gay marriage when they look at the whole “open relationship” thing. There has been NO push in the straight community to allow for “open marriages”, and those that do are looked at as total freaks and as people who are wishing to TRULY destroy the sanctity of marriage.
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I disagree on
"NO push in the straight community to allow for “open marriages”".
When they stripped "adultery" of having any punitive issue in divorce, it's the same "look the other way" thing.
The straights just don't talk about it like the gays do.
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Originally Posted by Kizzume
I wish this sort of thing could be talked about without that “bigot” label being thrown out there like a race card in a discussion about racial equality and quotas and such. But, that just seems to be the way it is. Flame me all you want, this is how I feel.
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Haha. I think you're on the wrong board for that.
I wouldn't be surprised if the routine "pro-gay" posters on this board will have little problem with your comments.
I know of a couple gay posters on other boards who might ruffle their feathers over your comments.
Gawd. I really wish I could put a copy of that Rick and Steve episode in your hands. I think you would finish watching it with the thought "That's what I'm talking about!"